How to rebuild

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maxlion
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The Lions are one of 5 teams currently rebuilding (along with Mtl, Sask, Wpg and Ott). The concensus on this board seems to be that our struggles are due to incompetence at the management level. I have a dissenting view.

In my opinion, the ingredients of a successful rebuild are:

1. Recognizing problems and needs early
2. Having strong management and leadership in key positions
3. Taking a long term approach, i.e sticking to the plan

Sask failed in #1. They expected to be contenders until they hit rock bottom. Wpg failed in #2, bringing ina succession of inexperienced mgmt and coaches and lacking leadership at qb and other key areas. Ott has been successful through addressing key weaknesses quickly, though long term success is yet to be seen. Not sure what Mtl is doing.

BC started their rebuild in earnest last year. Vets were replaced and replaced with young guys in a number of positions. This continued this year. In addition, experienced coaches were brought in to oversee the transition. There have been struggles as expected, but the team has stuck to the plan, and continue to compete. We have a lot of promising young talent together with veteran leadership.

A case in point is at the qb position. Wally has a reputation as a great identifier of talent. Tedford and Cortez have reps as great developers of talent. There is a veteran presence in Lulay and Beck to help protect an up and coming qb. While many here seem to think that Jennings success is in spite of poor coaching and mgmt, I would say the opposite, that coaching and mgmt deserve much of the credit for the success he has had. Recognizing needs, having in place strong mgmt and leadership, taking a long term approach.

My opinion on this is contrary to the consensus on here, but I call it as I see it. PR? No, just an honest opinion. This is textbook rebuilding. Wally has done it right, and we are in a great position moving forward. We have an exciting young team built for the future.
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MexicoLionFan
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The Lions actually possess a talent base that is good enough to compete for a Grey Cup, thus they should be trying to win now. Plus, the Lions are quite young at key positions, and have a lot to look forward to. They key for the Lions (or any CFL team) moving forward will be the QB position. Can they sign Jennings to a 2 or 3 year deal to stay in the CFL and properly develop, or will he bolt to an NFL practise roster??? If Jennings stays for a few years, then the Lions should be looking to win now at all costs.

Right now our Defensive personnel looks monstrous for next season. In fact, we might be able to trade a key player (say at LB because we have so many good ones) for another top talent on offence. With finally having the right personnel in the right positions on the DLine, our D can easily become the best in the league with a good coach because our LBs are outstanding and our DBs (with Fraser now at Safety) are more than adequate.

That leaves us with Offence and Special Teams. Special Teams can change overnight with a proper coach, end of story, so it boils down to offence and in the CFL that's mostly dependent on QB'ing and thus Jennings. We MUST be able to incorporate at least 3 CDN's on the OLine for next season. This will allow our offensive coaches to provide depth in the running game, and a faster, more explosive target for Jennings at receiver. But like S Ts and Defence, our Offence will depend upon our coaching situation.

Should Tedford stay? I don't know, a lot would depend on what he has to say to the public after the season is completed and what happens to Wally. The fact is, if this Pee-Wee coaching staffing is allowed to continue into next season, the Lions will be LUCKY to get more than 10,000 season tickets, which is a sad reality because with Jennings, the talent is here to win now. So for me, it all comes down to getting a coaching staff that can compete with CGY, EDM, HAM and TOR. Once again, we don't possess one.
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maxlion
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MexicoLionFan wrote:
Should Tedford stay? I don't know, a lot would depend on what he has to say to the public after the season is completed and what happens to Wally. The fact is, if this Pee-Wee coaching staffing is allowed to continue into next season, the Lions will be LUCKY to get more than 10,000 season tickets, which is a sad reality because with Jennings, the talent is here to win now. So for me, it all comes down to getting a coaching staff that can compete with CGY, EDM, HAM and TOR. Once again, we don't possess one.
I take it that you don't agree that having a coaching staff with boatloads of past success developing qbs has had a positive impact on Jennings development. For me, I see a pattern. Coaching staff with history of success developing qbs comes in, young qb shows great strides in becoming a potential new star. Cause/effect.
peeby
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I respect the opinion you express in starting this thread, but I don't think CFL GMs stay on top of things as long as you think they do. They fade like anyone does when they get older and have simply done the job too long. Things change. People don't always.

However, let's not go into that. When I read your opening sentence, I was really struck by your suggestion that BC is but one of five teams in rebuild status right now.

There's only nine teams in the league. Maybe you've inadvertently hit upon the reason why I find the CFL to be far less entertaining than it was in the past. Five out of nine rebuilding teams has gotta mean some dull football. It's almost like saying that over 50% of the teams stink. I'm wondering if that's normal. Don't follow hockey or NFL well enough to compare. Do more than 15 teams in the NHL blow that bad?
TheLionKing
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maxlion wrote:The Lions are one of 5 teams currently rebuilding (along with Mtl, Sask, Wpg and Ott). The concensus on this board seems to be that our struggles are due to incompetence at the management level. I have a dissenting view.

In my opinion, the ingredients of a successful rebuild are:

1. Recognizing problems and needs early
2. Having strong management and leadership in key positions
3. Taking a long term approach, i.e sticking to the plan

Sask failed in #1. They expected to be contenders until they hit rock bottom. Wpg failed in #2, bringing ina succession of inexperienced mgmt and coaches and lacking leadership at qb and other key areas. Ott has been successful through addressing key weaknesses quickly, though long term success is yet to be seen. Not sure what Mtl is doing.

BC started their rebuild in earnest last year. Vets were replaced and replaced with young guys in a number of positions. This continued this year. In addition, experienced coaches were brought in to oversee the transition. There have been struggles as expected, but the team has stuck to the plan, and continue to compete. We have a lot of promising young talent together with veteran leadership.

A case in point is at the qb position. Wally has a reputation as a great identifier of talent. Tedford and Cortez have reps as great developers of talent. There is a veteran presence in Lulay and Beck to help protect an up and coming qb. While many here seem to think that Jennings success is in spite of poor coaching and mgmt, I would say the opposite, that coaching and mgmt deserve much of the credit for the success he has had. Recognizing needs, having in place strong mgmt and leadership, taking a long term approach.

My opinion on this is contrary to the consensus on here, but I call it as I see it. PR? No, just an honest opinion. This is textbook rebuilding. Wally has done it right, and we are in a great position moving forward. We have an exciting young team built for the future.
What plan ? We have a plan ?

- Fans were promised of an aggressive defence. We got a conservative and passive defence.

- Promise of a H back. Anyone seen a H back lately

- Promise of a high tempo offence. What we see is a predictable and bland offence. Give the ball to Andrew Harris on 1st down and let him run between the tackles.
Last edited by TheLionKing on Sun Oct 18, 2015 11:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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cromartie
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maxlion wrote:
I take it that you don't agree that having a coaching staff with boatloads of past success developing qbs has had a positive impact on Jennings development. For me, I see a pattern. Coaching staff with history of success developing qbs comes in, young qb shows great strides in becoming a potential new star. Cause/effect.
If only Quarterback was the only position that mattered. Are we ahead of some of the other teams listed with Jennings? Yes. But...
In addition, experienced coaches were brought in to oversee the transition.
unfortunately for you, there are two additional components to a football team, and this team, as has been noted consistently here over the years, is poorly coached at both of those facets. I'm alright with Tedford, but much of the rest of this staff needs to be jettisoned. Tedford deserves the leeway to bring in his own guys, and has the demonstrated chops to facilitate successful quarterback development. Our offensive line is considerably better with a change in coaches, and I can't speak to the adaptability or lack thereof based on the presence of Cortez. More of this staff needs to go than needs to be retained, frankly.
dupsdell1
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maxlion wrote:The Lions are one of 5 teams currently rebuilding (along with Mtl, Sask, Wpg and Ott). The concensus on this board seems to be that our struggles are due to incompetence at the management level. I have a dissenting view.

In my opinion, the ingredients of a successful rebuild are:

1. Recognizing problems and needs early
2. Having strong management and leadership in key positions
3. Taking a long term approach, i.e sticking to the plan

Sask failed in #1. They expected to be contenders until they hit rock bottom. Wpg failed in #2, bringing ina succession of inexperienced mgmt and coaches and lacking leadership at qb and other key areas. Ott has been successful through addressing key weaknesses quickly, though long term success is yet to be seen. Not sure what Mtl is doing.

BC started their rebuild in earnest last year. Vets were replaced and replaced with young guys in a number of positions. This continued this year. In addition, experienced coaches were brought in to oversee the transition. There have been struggles as expected, but the team has stuck to the plan, and continue to compete. We have a lot of promising young talent together with veteran leadership.

A case in point is at the qb position. Wally has a reputation as a great identifier of talent. Tedford and Cortez have reps as great developers of talent. There is a veteran presence in Lulay and Beck to help protect an up and coming qb. While many here seem to think that Jennings success is in spite of poor coaching and mgmt, I would say the opposite, that coaching and mgmt deserve much of the credit for the success he has had. Recognizing needs, having in place strong mgmt and leadership, taking a long term approach.

My opinion on this is contrary to the consensus on here, but I call it as I see it. PR? No, just an honest opinion. This is textbook rebuilding. Wally has done it right, and we are in a great position moving forward. We have an exciting young team built for the future.


REBUILDING THE FAN BASE ALSO BET YOU THERE ARE ONLY 10.000 SEASON TICKET HOLDERS NEXT YEAR.
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DanoT
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IMO, Cortez is a horrible, old school, bland, boring, predictable OC that doesn't like to run the ball. I was hopeful that Tedford would have a positive influence on Cortez's flawed play calling but I have yet to see any evidence of the Tedford influence as this doesn't seem to be his team. I would even prefer Khari Jones returning to OC over Cortez for next year.

Washington has a least increased and varied the blitzing, but still goes conservative deep drop prevent D too much especially when trying (unsuccessfully too many times) to protect a lead.

Overall Wally has done a good job delivering players but has too much influence on the hiring of the coaching staff. On most teams the HC decides who becomes an assistant coach. Pretty much the only time that the Lions have not been out coached is vs the Riders.

Tedford should get another season to prove himself, but I fear the rest of the coaching staff and GM will remain the same. Except for McMann who will likely be asked to retire and then Wally and Sulsky will figure that they have done enough changes to satisfy the fan base. They will be wrong and unless boring predictable play is properly addressed, the fan base will dwindle. :bang: :bang:
maxlion
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Expectations for Cortez were too high. To deliver a winning, exciting, innovative offense with a broken down qb while developing the next guy all at the same time and playing rookies all over? He's done well under the circumstances. Our offense is looking pretty exciting these days.

Biggest reason for our lack if success this year is inexperience. I think Tedford's lack of experience should be included here too.
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WestCoastJoe
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Some well run teams rebuild without missing a beat. Some fans see more than rebuilding going on with the Lions. Some fans see dysfunction. And of course there is some good stuff mixed in with the bad.

Decisions by Wally ...

Promoting Mike Benevides to HC. Mistake. Maybe we do not even know if Benny could have been a good HC. Maybe he never got control of the team.

It certainly seems like there is dysfunction at the HC level right now with Jeff Tedford. Another mistake by Wally? Possible. Not sure yet. Same as with Benny.

Keeping Chuck McMann. Going to put that one on Tedford? Not this fan. Chuck is a Wally lifer.

Keeping Mark W. A mistake in the view of this fan. Is this the style of defence that Mark W really wants? He said he was going to bring attack style defence.

Draft foibles. Wally has his fingerprints all over that. If he does not have his fingerprints all over it, he has abdicated his responsibility. That is right in the bailiwick of the GM.

Cold dismissal of long serving veterans.

Failure to attract top, CFL-experienced veterans.

The kicking game. Somewhere amongst McCallum, Leone, Fera, etc. there was a stable kicking game. We failed to find it. Some of that is on the GM.

STs ... A shambles beyond a shambles. Chuck is Wally's guy. Why is he still here? Loyalty? Charity?

I suppose some fans support how Wally has handled Andrew Harris in the GM/player relationship. Some fans dislike it intensely.

Some fans who watch the team closely get the strong impression that there is meddling where there should be autonomy. Or maybe it is a case of different philosophies that cannot mesh.

To this fan, and to some others, this does not seem like a smooth rebuild whilst maintaining the product on the field. It seems like a team sliding down the slope to mediocrity and beyond. It seems like a train wreck.

And this despite there being some good stuff. We know the coaches work hard. We see the players busting their guts.

But some fans see so much dysfunction on the field. And some fans see Wally's fingerprints all over everything. In all of Wally's successful seasons, there is certainly no problem if the GM/HC has his fingerprints all over everything. But when the team slides from 2012 to 2013 to 2014 to 2015, it is not seen as a good thing to have your fingerprints all over everything. And when you are in your 26th year leading a CFL team, fans expect top quality football, not a team showing signs of missing the playoffs, and worse, playing unsatisfying, dysfunctional football. We are 5 and 10.

There is no debate here. Fans can and do see things differently. And fans state their opinions. Football is in the public eye. These opinions here say nothing against the character of the men involved, who are all deemed to be outstanding, hard working citizens. If people do not want scrutiny and judgment, stay out of pro football.

Oh you hate Wally. No. Oh you want to see him lynched. No. This is about the product on the field. Too much familiarity after 13 years? Possibly. The longer someone is in public office, people look for change. It happened to Stephen Harper, after, I think he said, 9 and a half years. Fans have heard Wally work the media for 13 years now. Yes, he has to work the media. And that comes with a price.

No debate here ... Differering opinions accepted. No one is about to change their view.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

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Some well run teams rebuild without missing a beat. Some fans see more than rebuilding going on with the Lions. Some fans see dysfunction. And of course there is some good stuff mixed in with the bad.

Decisions by Wally ...

Promoting Mike Benevides to HC. Mistake. Maybe we do not even know if Benny could have been a good HC. Maybe he never got control of the team.

It certainly seems like there is dysfunction at the HC level right now with Jeff Tedford. Another mistake by Wally? Possible. Not sure yet. Same as with Benny.

Keeping Chuck McMann. Going to put that one on Tedford? Not this fan. Chuck is a Wally lifer.

Keeping Mark W. A mistake in the view of this fan. Is this the style of defence that Mark W really wants? He said he was going to bring attack style defence.

WCJ
I just quoted the coaching aspect of your post WCJ. It had so much excellent analysis and I agree with every one of your points including drafting, free agents, personnel decisions etc.

In the rare cases in the CFL, over the past decade or so, when we have had a Head Coach come to the CFL with a background as an NFL offensive coordinator, they have been successful and innovative. Hufnagel has more than made his mark on Calgary and his influence as a former offensive coordinator impacted the Calgary offence very positively. The same was true for Mark Trestmann, who did a great job in Montreal. Both of these gentlemen also ran their offences in their early seasons as a CFL Head Coach. Huf called the plays and not Dickenson to begin with in Calgary and Trestmann called the plays in Montreal.

Jeff Tedford never called an NFL game but he was hired as an offensive coordinator with Tampa Bay and you don't get that opportunity in the NFL without an excellent resume and a reputation as having an excellent offensive mind. They have so many good hiring choices for an offensive coordinator in the NFL.

But Tedford has not led the offence here in B.C. He has not called the plays. He did not even implement the offensive system he said he wanted to implement. Instead he handed it over to Cortez or was told to hand it over to Cortez, or Cortez denmanded control of the offence,as part of his hiring process and he completely misued our tight ends to the point that we got rid of them.

Its confusing to say the least.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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B.C.FAN
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Blitz wrote:In the rare cases in the CFL, over the past decade or so, when we have had a Head Coach come to the CFL with a background as an NFL offensive coordinator, they have been successful and innovative. Hufnagel has more than made his mark on Calgary and his influence as a former offensive coordinator impacted the Calgary offence very positively. The same was true for Mark Trestmann, who did a great job in Montreal. Both of these gentlemen also ran their offences in their early seasons as a CFL Head Coach. Huf called the plays and not Dickenson to begin with in Calgary and Trestmann called the plays in Montreal.

Jeff Tedford never called an NFL game but he was hired as an offensive coordinator with Tampa Bay and you don't get that opportunity in the NFL without an excellent resume and a reputation as having an excellent offensive mind. They have so many good hiring choices for an offensive coordinator in the NFL.

But Tedford has not led the offence here in B.C. He has not called the plays. He did not even implement the offensive system he said he wanted to implement. Instead he handed it over to Cortez or was told to hand it over to Cortez, or Cortez denmanded control of the offence,as part of his hiring process and he completely misued our tight ends to the point that we got rid of them.

Its confusing to say the least.
Good points, Blitz. The Lions have done a good job of rebuilding. I love their talent at most positions. As other posters have said, they have the talent to compete with anyone. The fact they've held nine fourth-quarter leads and blown six of them speaks to their competitiveness but also their inexperience and the failings of their coaching staff. The latter is on Tedford. I hope Tedford will learn from his first year CFL head-coaching experience and will put more of his own stamp on the team and the coaching staff next year. It won't take much to turn a 5-10 team into a 10-5 team.
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WestCoastJoe
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Blitz wrote:
Some well run teams rebuild without missing a beat. Some fans see more than rebuilding going on with the Lions. Some fans see dysfunction. And of course there is some good stuff mixed in with the bad.

Decisions by Wally ...

Promoting Mike Benevides to HC. Mistake. Maybe we do not even know if Benny could have been a good HC. Maybe he never got control of the team.

It certainly seems like there is dysfunction at the HC level right now with Jeff Tedford. Another mistake by Wally? Possible. Not sure yet. Same as with Benny.

Keeping Chuck McMann. Going to put that one on Tedford? Not this fan. Chuck is a Wally lifer.

Keeping Mark W. A mistake in the view of this fan. Is this the style of defence that Mark W really wants? He said he was going to bring attack style defence.

WCJ
I just quoted the coaching aspect of your post WCJ. It had so much excellent analysis and I agree with every one of your points including drafting, free agents, personnel decisions etc.

In the rare cases in the CFL, over the past decade or so, when we have had a Head Coach come to the CFL with a background as an NFL offensive coordinator, they have been successful and innovative. Hufnagel has more than made his mark on Calgary and his influence as a former offensive coordinator impacted the Calgary offence very positively. The same was true for Mark Trestmann, who did a great job in Montreal. Both of these gentlemen also ran their offences in their early seasons as a CFL Head Coach. Huf called the plays and not Dickenson to begin with in Calgary and Trestmann called the plays in Montreal.

Jeff Tedford never called an NFL game but he was hired as an offensive coordinator with Tampa Bay and you don't get that opportunity in the NFL without an excellent resume and a reputation as having an excellent offensive mind. They have so many good hiring choices for an offensive coordinator in the NFL.

But Tedford has not led the offence here in B.C. He has not called the plays. He did not even implement the offensive system he said he wanted to implement. Instead he handed it over to Cortez or was told to hand it over to Cortez, or Cortez denmanded control of the offence,as part of his hiring process and he completely misued our tight ends to the point that we got rid of them.

Its confusing to say the least.
Thanks, Blitz.

Under Wally's administration, we have usually had very good talent. No surprise there.

What many fans have become tired of is the philosophy and the systems he favours. We have changed HC. We have changed DC and OC. And yet we still see the systems Wally favours.

He is the GM, and he is entitled to have the systems he likes. But many fans want attack oriented football, as we see around the league. Modern stuff. Going for it on O and D, rather than hanging on, trying to protect, trying to play it safe. Bltizing, effectively. Overloads at the LOS. Defenders not static, as if they were on a chess board. Run blitzes. Diversified running game. Diversified passing game. Up to date, modern STs. LOL Our STs do not belong to any era. They belong in a Marx Brothers movie, comical if not so sad. Many fans want to see the end to what is perceived as cronyism, keeping on long time associates who are long past being effective.

Our win/loss record has been in constant decline since 2012. It is hard for many fans to see this current edition of the team as being anything other than a disaster. It is certainly not a smooth, professionally run rebuild. It is hard to justify, or explain away, or do a P.R. spin for a record of 5 and 10. Yes, we were in many or most or even almost all of those games, but we lost, in ways that were astonishing, and yet seemed inevitable.

Much of this must be attributed to the man in charge. And that man still seems to be Wally Buono, in his 13th year here. Some want to blame it on the HC. Well the two Head Coaches who followed Wally Buono were hired by Wally Buono. Wally's fingerprints are all over everything, including contact with the media. In good times, it can be gratifying to see one's handiwork everywhere. In bad times, not so much.

On top of all this, there seems to be dysfunction in the coaching staff. Is everyone on the same page? Where is the stamp of Jeff Tedford on this team? Where are the systems that were put forth in the media at the start of the year? Is there meddling from the top, that being Wally? What is the difference between effective influence and meddling? It is in the results. And the results we see are not good.

Can this team to be turned around in time to make the playoffs? To win games we should win? Anything is possible. But seemingly not likely. Not with the painful dysfunction that we see on the field.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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MexicoLionFan
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B.C.FAN wrote:
Blitz wrote:In the rare cases in the CFL, over the past decade or so, when we have had a Head Coach come to the CFL with a background as an NFL offensive coordinator, they have been successful and innovative. Hufnagel has more than made his mark on Calgary and his influence as a former offensive coordinator impacted the Calgary offence very positively. The same was true for Mark Trestmann, who did a great job in Montreal. Both of these gentlemen also ran their offences in their early seasons as a CFL Head Coach. Huf called the plays and not Dickenson to begin with in Calgary and Trestmann called the plays in Montreal.

Jeff Tedford never called an NFL game but he was hired as an offensive coordinator with Tampa Bay and you don't get that opportunity in the NFL without an excellent resume and a reputation as having an excellent offensive mind. They have so many good hiring choices for an offensive coordinator in the NFL.

But Tedford has not led the offence here in B.C. He has not called the plays. He did not even implement the offensive system he said he wanted to implement. Instead he handed it over to Cortez or was told to hand it over to Cortez, or Cortez denmanded control of the offence,as part of his hiring process and he completely misued our tight ends to the point that we got rid of them.

Its confusing to say the least.
Good points, Blitz. The Lions have done a good job of rebuilding. I love their talent at most positions. As other posters have said, they have the talent to compete with anyone. The fact they've held nine fourth-quarter leads and blown six of them speaks to their competitiveness but also their inexperience and the failings of their coaching staff. The latter is on Tedford. I hope Tedford will learn from his first year CFL head-coaching experience and will put more of his own stamp on the team and the coaching staff next year. It won't take much to turn a 5-10 team into a 10-5 team.

Blitz, Joe, and BCFAN are all correct in their comments. As BCFAN stated, with proper coaching this team could be 12-6 next season with the talent they have. But remember our talent hit an all time "Wally low" this past season and until the half way point this season. For the first time in a long while, I was very concerned about our talent base, especially at QB as I felt that Lulay was not going to make it back. But Jennings has suddenly rocketed into the main role, we added some key personnel as the season progressed and FINALLY put guys where they belonged. Suddenly, our talent stacks up against anyone else in the league (that is until Harris leaves). Wally's behaviour during the offseason and during training camp was reckless to say the least. Over the last two years he has gone into the season without a healthy LT and without adequate depth, while handing out starter's salaries to guys that can't start. He cut our KR and backup RBs without anyone proven to take their respective spots, and that was a disaster until Rainey showed up, and he has had some growing pains as well. What he did to McCallum was disgraceful and the risk he is taking with Leone is also very reckless. I still don't think our receiver talent is top notch, and we are dangerously low on CDN talent because outside of Kelly Bates drafts, we simply haven't drafted well under Wally, and Wally is not able to attract FAs.

As Blitz said, Huff and Trestman both knew how crucial play calling is and were slow to hand it over (I don't think Trestman ever did). Tedford doesn't even seem to have a say in the offence at all, which is bizarre beyond belief, because I know for myself, I would have had almost complete control over the offence in year one, and certainly the play calling. I don't get Tedford's approach at all and as he is playing with fire in BC and with its fan base.

And as for as Joe's comments, Wally's fingerprints are ALL OVER the on field product largely because he still controls this football team through all THREE coordinators. They do what HE wants and thus our style of play is the SAME STYLE he has run for 20 years...it's a bit stale to say the least. And as I have said ad nauseam, unless Wally's VICE GRIP over the on field product disintegrates this off season, nothing will change! With or without the likes of Jennings and Harris.
"Condemnation Without Investigation is the height of ignorance."

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maxlion
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MexicoLionFan wrote:
As Blitz said, Huff and Trestman both knew how crucial play calling is and were slow to hand it over (I don't think Trestman ever did). Tedford doesn't even seem to have a say in the offence at all, which is bizarre beyond belief, because I know for myself, I would have had almost complete control over the offence in year one, and certainly the play calling. I don't get Tedford's approach at all and as he is playing with fire in BC and with its fan base.

And as for as Joe's comments, Wally's fingerprints are ALL OVER the on field product largely because he still controls this football team through all THREE coordinators. They do what HE wants and thus our style of play is the SAME STYLE he has run for 20 years...it's a bit stale to say the least. And as I have said ad nauseam, unless Wally's VICE GRIP over the on field product disintegrates this off season, nothing will change! With or without the likes of Jennings and Harris.
Lots of fair and good points being made here, but I do question the above narrative. Not being in the coaches meetings, I can't disprove it, but I also don't see any strong evidence of an unhealthy degree of meddling. Of course, there has to be coordination between the coaches and gm on personnel needs and so forth. Head coaches also have be willing to delegate to and trust their assistants, and this is especially when true when one of your assistants (Cortez) has a long and proven track record of success.

What is your evidence for the statement: "Tedford doesn't even seem to have a say in the offence at all"? I think he backed off on a couple "innovations"--the no huddles, the H-back--because it wasn't working very well, and also injuries to Lulay and Morrah. Sometimes you have to evaluate and readjust.
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