Randy Ambrosie optimistic about 2021

[Hambone]

I like the idea of the CFL and XFL exploring opportunities to grow and market the game. Both leagues have their own strengths. I don't want to see a merger, especially if it would mean eliminating the unique features of the Canadian game.

I 100% agree. Merging makes little sense unless they happen to shift to playing similar seasons. Canadian weather says the CFL should stick to their current season timing. Avoiding competing against NCAA and NFL football dictates the XFL should stick to spring football ergo playing during the CFL offseason.

I do though think there can be opportunities to pursue that benefit both leagues without making any changes to the timing of seasons or rule formats. "Sharing" of players for instance could benefit both. By "sharing" I mean allowing players to participate in both leagues concurrently so they aren't actually trying to compete against each other for the same players. Let a CFL player sign a two year deal and allow him to play in the XFL during the CFL offseason and return to the CFL to carry on under his contract for the next season. Similarly there could be opportunities to share officials making it possible to turn officiating into a full time year around occupation. There can also be cost saving synergies to be had in areas of football ops if they work together on recruiting, scouting, holding combines, tryout camps etc.

[maxlion]

Ambrosie jumped the gun on this announcement.

Nobody has any issue with working with another league to grow the game. But there are tweets going around about mergers, changing rules, etc..

XFL has nothing to lose here, they are just an idea at this point. CFL has a lot of history behind it.

There needs to be more thought going into announcements like this. Wait until you have something substantial. Then you can explain, celebrate, whatever.

[B.C.FAN]

Ambrosie jumped the gun on this announcement.

Nobody has any issue with working with another league to grow the game. But there are tweets going around about mergers, changing rules, etc..

XFL has nothing to lose here, they are just an idea at this point. CFL has a lot of history behind it.

There needs to be more thought going into announcements like this. Wait until you have something substantial. Then you can explain, celebrate, whatever.

I don’t think Ambrosie jumped the gun. I think some commentators, particularly Dave Naylor and Rod Pedersen, jumped the gun by speculating that these talks will inevitably lead to a merger of the two leagues and the end of three-down football, with its fan-friendly field size, backfield motion,
play clock and wide-open kicking game.

Ambrosie has done a lot of lengthy interviews today, and he’s shot down any speculation about where the talks will lead. I applaud him for being transparent and exploring ways the CFL’s legacy can benefit from the XFL’s dynamic marketing power, and vice versa. Anything that gets people talking in the offseason about the CFL’s growth is good for the league.

[TheLionKing]

I just hope the CFL don't abandon the rules that makes this league unique and exciting just for the sake of "growing the game"

[maxlion]

I don’t think Ambrosie jumped the gun. I think some commentators, particularly Dave Naylor and Rod Pedersen, jumped the gun by speculating that these talks will inevitably lead to a merger of the two leagues and the end of three-down football, with its fan-friendly field size, backfield motion,
play clock and wide-open kicking game.

Ambrosie has done a lot of lengthy interviews today, and he’s shot down any speculation about where the talks will lead. I applaud him for being transparent and exploring ways the CFL’s legacy can benefit from the XFL’s dynamic marketing power, and vice versa. Anything that gets people talking in the offseason about the CFL’s growth is good for the league.

I respectfully disagree.

1. The media will do what they do. I don't blame them for speculating under the circumstances.
2. Ambrosie may have been circumspect in his statements, but some of the XFL statements suggest something more. It is up to Ambrosie to keep a lid on things as he is the one with the most to lose.
3. I am unsure of the XFL's dynamic marketing power. They have a new owner and their past efforts led to massive losses.
4. Not ANYTHING that gets people talking is good. If it makes the league look desperate or weak, that's not good.

When the XFL says they are putting their season on hold pending these talks, that raises flags. What's going on here?

[Huge Talent]

It could be a marketing ploy. Any CFL talk is good for the league.

That said, it's weird to drop this bomb and have no detail whatsoever.

Either way, reeks of desperation.

I like the idea of a new CFL - Continental football League. If that's what it takes to keep things moving. We all know the league is in trouble. The pandemic might be the dagger. Getting some hype and chatter can't hurt.

Maybe Mexico gets involved!

[Hambone]

That said, it's weird to drop this bomb and have no detail whatsoever.

Either way, reeks of desperation.

Sometimes it's best that a business entity get out ahead of things to try to form the narrative. It's certainly in the best interests of Ambrosie and the CFL that he break the news as opposed to some asshat like Dunk suddenly breaking it along with an number of opinions of what will transpire like mergers, fundamental changes to the CFL game and any other number of changes that a fertile mind can put together. I highly doubt the CFL could have kept the fact they were talking to the XFL under wraps for long. It would only be a matter of a very brief time before somebody in the media broke the story with their own spin to however much or however little they knew. Perhaps Ambrosie did speak up when he did because he already knew some media member(s) were already poised to let that cat out of the bag. Best to be out in front of that inevitability as opposed to having to start out in total damage control. Just like football it's better to be on offense with possession of the ball instead of being on defense.

[Huge Talent]

That said, it's weird to drop this bomb and have no detail whatsoever.

Either way, reeks of desperation.

Sometimes it's best that a business entity get out ahead of things to try to form the narrative. It's certainly in the best interests of Ambrosie and the CFL that he break the news as opposed to some asshat like Dunk suddenly breaking it along with an number of opinions of what will transpire like mergers, fundamental changes to the CFL game and any other number of changes that a fertile mind can put together. I highly doubt the CFL could have kept the fact they were talking to the XFL under wraps for long. It would only be a matter of a very brief time before somebody in the media broke the story with their own spin to however much or however little they knew. Perhaps Ambrosie did speak up when he did because he already knew some media member(s) were already poised to let that cat out of the bag. Best to be out in front of that inevitability as opposed to having to start out in total damage control. Just like football it's better to be on offense with possession of the ball instead of being on defense.

Yeah that all makes sense. I still wonder why, though, if he's going to make the announcement, why wouldn't be provide something substantive. The fact that the two leagues are communicating isn't news imo. I'd expect them to have open lines with each other. What are they discussing? It's awkward to not shed some light. Given the fact that the xfl is holding off on plans pending the outcome of these discussions, we know that it's likely big.

Basically ambrosie said "I know something but I'm not telling you."

Imho it comes across a little bit bush league, no pun intended.

[maxlion]

I agree the announcement was ill-planned, but what's done is done.

I am not opposed to potential partnerships, alignment, whatever with the XFL. I think that it is a good direction... provided that they do not stray too far from the traditions of Canadian football, in particular: 3 downs, team names/identities, perhaps ratio.

Having team/league ownership in the hands of a US based corporation would also be concerning. Hopefully that is not on the table.

[SammyGreene]

Some random thoughts the CFL/XFL potential partnership:

-this is just another friendly reminder of the league’s bleak financial picture. It was roughly a year ago we learned of the league losing $20 million in 2019. I was shocked at the time.

-Is Ambrosie hearing from potential owners there is dwindling interest in a national league model in the global world of economics? He certainly must have got feedback when the Als were for sale and now the Lions too. Maybe it’s MLSE pushing the narrative as losing them would almost certainly mean the end of the Argos.

-With Braley gone, I do feel like Bob Young is the lone private owner willing to lose money for his love of the CFL, although $10 million per year is nothing to MLSE.

-Since the pandemic started BellMedia has made it clear the league means nothing more to them than a good programming option for their TSN cable channels from June to November. Although it could be argued the $50 million per year TV deal and needing tenants for a number of new or renovated stadiums are the only 2 things keeping the league afloat.

[BC 1988]

^^ I have been thinking exactly the same thing. Tom Mayenknect is not known to be a sensationalist reporter and this is how he feels about the CFL-XFL dialogue and what's behind it.


I am grateful for my 50 seasons of following the CFL (and the GC Portal is a nice memento for a long-time fan), but I accept the possibility of change or disappearance of the game as we have had it.

The brutal facts are we are a shrinking minority of die-hards. If the under 45 age group no longer considers the game relevant, so be it. As Blitz mentioned, the way CFL coaching systems frittered away our undeniable advantage over the NFL as a more entertaining game is in large part to blame.

[Hambone]

^^ I have been thinking exactly the same thing. Tom Mayenknect is not known to be a sensationalist reporter and this is how he feels about the CFL-XFL dialogue and what's behind it.


I am grateful for my 50 seasons of following the CFL (and the GC Portal is a nice memento for a long-time fan), but I accept the possibility of change or disappearance of the game as we have had it.

The brutal facts are we are a shrinking minority of die-hards. If the under 45 age group no longer considers the game relevant, so be it. As Blitz mentioned, the way CFL coaching systems frittered away our undeniable advantage over the NFL as a more entertaining game is in large part to blame.

While the CFL used to have that advantage I don't know if they've frittered it away as much as the NFL game and NCAA game have evolved to be closer to the CFL passing game than it used to be. I recall Gil Brandt talking about how back in the day pass blocking wasn't even taught until players hit the pros. I presume he was talking the 50s, 60s and maybe early 70s.

In 1970 only 9 teams of 26 teams scored over 300 points. The 49ers led with 352. Overall teams averaged 19.4 points for per game. NOTE: this was in a 14 game season.
Team per game passing averages in 1970 were 13.8 completions on 26.9 attempts for 161.4 yards with 1.2 TDs and 1.4 Ints.
Team per game running averages in 1970 were 31.4 carries for 120.4 yards and 0.8 TDs

In 2020 only 2 teams out of 32 managed fewer than 300 points, ironically the 2 NY teams. 14 of 32 scored more than 400 with Buffalo topping the league at 501. Overall the teams averaged 24.8 points per game.
Team per game passing averages in 2020 were 23.0 completions on 35.2 attempts for 240.2 yards with 1.7 TDs with 0.8 Ints.
Team per game running averages in 2020 were 26.9 carries for 118.9 yards and 1.0 TDs

The numbers indicate subtle change but nonetheless the NFL game has gone from 54% running plays and 46% passing to 57% passing and 43% running plays. A big difference in today's game is in the fact that QBs completed only 51.1% of their passes in 1970 compared to 2020's 65.2%. In terms of generating excitement in 1970 there were 2.3 running plays for every pass completion. In 2020 there was 1.2 running plays per pass completion.

Another big factor in overall scoring is FG accuracy. In 1970 it was 59.4%. In 2020 it was 84.2%. One of the interesting tidbits I found in the 1970 stats was that while Tom Dempsey set the NFL record with a 63 yarder he was only good for 8 out of 21 from 30 yards and longer and 52.9% overall. The CFL has also enjoyed similar improvements in passing and FG average.

[BC 1988]

Thanks for the 1970 vs 2020 stat comparison. It does provide some perspective on how the NFL has changed .

I remember what I posted back in 2013 about how the casual fan reacts to what looks like a boring game (3rd post down the page)
https://www.lionbackers.com/bc_lions/vi ... me#p333849
My friend had bought seasons tickets with me in 2010-11 because of Tempire/new BC Place . The first game he went to was the 1987 GC when he was 17--his school got tickets to go, he thought it was great. When last year's season was hanging in the balance, I had to keep him informed as to what was going on. Now I doubt I could drag him to a game with free tickets.

[BC 1988]

As if we need this too--what amounts to QAnon for football.

RF already has several pages about this bizarre organization.

and their unfounded claims.
Both Farhan and Naylor said UFPA is making things up (since they are a non-involved party.)
The CFL just reacted

I guess the only interesting thing about this is that the XFL is silent (so far) but this appeared on their news hub last October.
https://www.xflnewshub.com/xfl-news/uni ... fl-alumni/
along with a story by the same author about today's events
https://www.xflnewshub.com/xfl-news/ufp ... cellation/

[Hambone]

This UFPA seems to be more like a pro football players' lobby or advocacy group that has no formal ties to any leagues or PAs. They only came into existence less than 7 months ago. The only things relative to the CFL I could find was an article making players aware of the CFL option year that would be included in their initial contracts and the fact that one of their advisors, James "Quon" Rodgers is a former CFL player (10 games for Montreal in 2014). Perhaps they can serve a purpose for players in leagues like the XFL and AAF who I don't think they existed long enough to have formed any sort of PA to represent them. They have absolutely no business sticking their noses into CFLPA affairs or making comments that undermine CFLPA efforts. It would be good if the CFLPA also refuted the UFPA's comments.

http://unitedplayers.org/announcing-the-ufpa-2/