2012 WDF Attendance

[sj-roc]

I think Vancouver still owes Vachon something after the Canucks stole their logo!

Which Canucks logo are you talking about?

As far as the attendance, 45,000 was my realistic target goal, so I’ll be happy if they get that.

As I said last night, 45k is looking like absolute best case scenario and I haven't seen anything since then to change my mind. To call it realistic right now is stretching. I'm still not even convinced we'll beat last year's 41,313 figure.

[almo89]

I think Vancouver still owes Vachon something after the Canucks stole their logo!

Which Canucks logo are you talking about?

As far as the attendance, 45,000 was my realistic target goal, so I’ll be happy if they get that.

As I said last night, 45k is looking like absolute best case scenario and I haven't seen anything since then to change my mind. To call it realistic right now is stretching. I'm still not even convinced we'll beat last year's 41,313 figure.

That would be sad if they can't beat last year's totals. Last year's excuse was that people spent on their money on the Grey Cup. Does anyone remember how many tickets were sold last year around this point?

[sj-roc]

I think Vancouver still owes Vachon something after the Canucks stole their logo!

Which Canucks logo are you talking about?

As far as the attendance, 45,000 was my realistic target goal, so I’ll be happy if they get that.

As I said last night, 45k is looking like absolute best case scenario and I haven't seen anything since then to change my mind. To call it realistic right now is stretching. I'm still not even convinced we'll beat last year's 41,313 figure.

That would be sad if they can't beat last year's totals. Last year's excuse was that people spent on their money on the Grey Cup. Does anyone remember how many tickets were sold last year around this point?

I have no idea. The posts on here from that period should still be accessible and offer a clue. What I'd like to know is, what were last year's one-off ticket prices?

There are four price points this year:
$46 back endzone
$56 side endzone
$78 0-20yd line
$98 between 20's

I'm pretty sure they were less than this but not sure how much. My side endzone seat last year was $42.48 all taxes & fees included but I'm not sure if that was a STH discounted rate over what a "fresh" buyer would pay.

[J5V]

From last years attendance thread ....

News 1130 announced 34,140 sold as of Wednesday 10:30 a.m.
News 1130 announced 36,000 sold as of Thursday morning

I am pretty sure the tickets last year were priced (including all fees) as follows:

$43 back endzone
$53 side endzone
$73 0-20yd line
$93 between 20's

[David]

Does anyone remember how many tickets were sold last year around this point?

Definitely ahead of last year's pace. I did a little research and Lionbacker member jcalhoun quoted Global TV on November 19 (Saturday - the day before the game), "it was reported that ticket sales are just over 38,000, and so a crowd in the low 40k range is expected" (which ended up being bang on with 41,313 attending).

It looks like they've been selling roughly 1,000 per day since the West Semi. Just spitballing here, but if they hit 40,000 by end of day Thursday (that's the magic number that will convince some fence-sitters this is a real "event"), I can see them moving the following:

4,000 over the next two prime selling days (roughly 2,000 Friday and 2,000 Saturday)
1,000 or so Sunday morning + walk-up
= 45,000 (or something close to that)

Surprised I haven't seen any TV ads (which I've definitely caught on occasion during the regular season!). The 4 colour ads they're running in the Sun and Province are not too dissimilar to the regular season as well - 1/3 of a page with the heading, "Defending Our Cup With Pride." Considering they're going to be making a killing in gate receipts, I'd hardly classify this as an all-out "media blitz" (special thanks to the Sun today though for their 5 page "Lions Extra").


DH

[almo89]

Does anyone remember how many tickets were sold last year around this point?

Definitely ahead of last year's pace. I did a little research and Lionbacker member jcalhoun quoted Global TV on November 19 (Saturday - the day before the game), "it was reported that ticket sales are just over 38,000, and so a crowd in the low 40k range is expected" (which ended up being bang on with 41,313 attending).

It looks like they've been selling roughly 1,000 per day since the West Semi. Just spitballing here, but if they hit 40,000 by end of day Thursday (that's the magic number that will convince some fence-sitters this is a real "event"), I can see them moving the following:

4,000 over the next two prime selling days (roughly 2,000 Friday and 2,000 Saturday)
1,000 or so Sunday morning + walk-up
= 45,000 (or something close to that)

Surprised I haven't seen any TV ads (which I've definitely caught on occasion during the regular season!). The 4 colour ads they're running in the Sun and Province are not too dissimilar to the regular season as well - 1/3 of a page with the heading, "Defending Our Cup With Pride." Considering they're going to be making a killing in gate receipts, I'd hardly classify this as an all-out "media blitz" (special thanks to the Sun today though for their 5 page "Lions Extra").


DH

Thanks for the info. IMO the Lions had a month to hype of this game, but I've barely seen any. Like you said, it's your typical ads that we've been seeing for a while. I've said this before and I'll say it again. Braley has been a great owner for us. Saved the Lions from folding, but he's too old school these days. Him and Skulsky believe that with the Lions winning alone should be enough to sell itself out. Same thing with BCPII which was the expectation of the building selling itself out.

It's great to hear that we are ahead of last year's pace, but there's so much opportunity to grow the BC Lions as a brand name like the Canucks. Comparing Lions to the Canucks is really crazy, but I think any team should emulate what the Canucks have been doing for the past 10 years even if it's on a smaller scale. Nick Hebeler was on Pratt's show last night and Pratt told him something like "Lions have already sold 36,000 tickets, how good is that?" Hebeler's response was alone the lines of "It should be sold out by now".

[Upper Bowl]

Which Canucks logo are you talking about?

I think Vancouver still owes Vachon something after the Canucks stole their logo!

[B.C.FAN]

I got an email from the Lions tonight saying that over 36,000 tickets have been sold and as a season ticketholder I can buy up to 8 tickets aside from my normal seats at the season ticket holder discounted rate ($37.25 in my case for the end zone). I had long ago bought 7 extras at this price before public sales of playoff tickets opened. I'm surprised they're still trying to flog discount offers to season ticketholders at this late stage.

[sj-roc]

Does anyone remember how many tickets were sold last year around this point?

Definitely ahead of last year's pace. I did a little research and Lionbacker member jcalhoun quoted Global TV on November 19 (Saturday - the day before the game), "it was reported that ticket sales are just over 38,000, and so a crowd in the low 40k range is expected" (which ended up being bang on with 41,313 attending).

It looks like they've been selling roughly 1,000 per day since the West Semi. Just spitballing here, but if they hit 40,000 by end of day Thursday (that's the magic number that will convince some fence-sitters this is a real "event"), I can see them moving the following:

4,000 over the next two prime selling days (roughly 2,000 Friday and 2,000 Saturday)
1,000 or so Sunday morning + walk-up
= 45,000 (or something close to that)

Surprised I haven't seen any TV ads (which I've definitely caught on occasion during the regular season!). The 4 colour ads they're running in the Sun and Province are not too dissimilar to the regular season as well - 1/3 of a page with the heading, "Defending Our Cup With Pride." Considering they're going to be making a killing in gate receipts, I'd hardly classify this as an all-out "media blitz" (special thanks to the Sun today though for their 5 page "Lions Extra").


DH

Comparing with last year

It's a bit difficult to compare the pace from last year because we didn't clinch a home playoff game until we won our last regular season game 43-1 against Mtl on Sat Nov 5, which also happened to be the last overall regular season game for the whole league. So we really only had a two week sales window. I also looked at last year's attendance thread on here and there was a Sun article in there stating that we were only at 22k on the Tuesday before the semifinal weekend. So we moved almost 20k ducats in the last 12 days to reach 41,313. Anyone know where we were Tuesday of last week (i.e., the 6th)? A fair bit above 22k I suspect, which means our daily pace must be slower than last year if the sales figures right now and the equivalent point last year are about the same.

We clinched first this year with the Reilly game we won vs Edm on Fri Oct 19. This year's window was just over four weeks, fully twice as long. So looked at in this light, (a) without a Grey Cup game having already taxed people's wallets, (b) without the usual distraction of the NHL, and also (c) with, as per J5V's post, ticket prices being only slightly above what they were last year, the fact that we are merely matching last year's pace has to be considered disappointing. Mind you, it might be the case that the final sales tally doesn't really depend on how long the selling window is open: perhaps the people who are all in to buy will do so one way or the other regardless how tight the window is.


Comparing the 2011 & 2012 finales

Perhaps just as perplexing is the comparison of the 2011 & 2012 regular season finales. In 2011 we had everything to play for in our finale vs Mtl. We won that game 43-1 to finish at 11-7 and in first place after invoking a winning 3-way tiebreaker with Cgy & Edm who had both just completed their regular seasons in the preceding 24 hours before our kickoff. But a loss would have bumped us down to 10-8 into third behind both Alberta rivals. For our 2012 finale however, nobody — neither us nor Ssk — had anything to play for with all playoff seeding having already wrapped the night before.

So naturally the Mtl game drew the larger crowd, right?

Wrong!

Sat 2011/11/05: Mtl 1 @ BC 43, att 35,454
Sat 2012/11/03: Ssk 6 @ BC 17, att 36,357

I suppose the Ssk factor might have bumped up the number somewhat but I never got the impression that night that Rider fans were out to any great extent compared to other games. Equally confounding, that 2012 season finale was easily the most meaningless regular season game since BCP reopened, yet is also the largest regular season crowd we've had in this stretch (aside from the 50k grand re-opening — can we call it the largest "football" crowd?).


The Tipping Point

Your point about hitting 40k and what happens beyond that is precisely why I decided on Sunday to chart the exact sales count in the bestselling part of the UB: Lions' coach's sideline area. I was curious to see the rate of uptake and whether there would be a tipping point beyond which sales quickly escalate. This hasn't happened yet that I can tell — so far it's been a steady, gentle ramp that, if persistent, would make reaching 45k a VERY tall order.

[sj-roc]

Which Canucks logo are you talking about?

I think Vancouver still owes Vachon something after the Canucks stole their logo!

Thanks; I was thinking principal logos located on the sweaterfront — I believe this one is a shoulder patch, isn't it? It never came up in my mind as I was thinking back on all the sweaterfront logos.

[TheLionKing]

I got an email from the Lions tonight saying that over 36,000 tickets have been sold and as a season ticketholder I can buy up to 8 tickets aside from my normal seats at the season ticket holder discounted rate ($37.25 in my case for the end zone). I had long ago bought 7 extras at this price before public sales of playoff tickets opened. I'm surprised they're still trying to flog discount offers to season ticketholders at this late stage.

Got the same email. Seems like the Lions are banking on season ticket holders to help them sell tickets.

[sj-roc]

It looks like they've been selling roughly 1,000 per day since the West Semi. Just spitballing here, but if they hit 40,000 by end of day Thursday (that's the magic number that will convince some fence-sitters this is a real "event"), I can see them moving the following:

4,000 over the next two prime selling days (roughly 2,000 Friday and 2,000 Saturday)
1,000 or so Sunday morning + walk-up
= 45,000 (or something close to that)

Comparing with last year

Mind you, it might be the case that the final sales tally doesn't really depend on how long the selling window is open: perhaps the people who are all in to buy will do so one way or the other regardless how tight the window is.


The Tipping Point

Your point about hitting 40k and what happens beyond that is precisely why I decided on Sunday to chart the exact sales count in the bestselling part of the UB: Lions' coach's sideline area. I was curious to see the rate of uptake and whether there would be a tipping point beyond which sales quickly escalate. This hasn't happened yet that I can tell — so far it's been a steady, gentle ramp that, if persistent, would make reaching 45k a VERY tall order.

A thought just occurred to me re: the playoff attendance behaviour of this market. Over the years on this board, dating back even as far as the 2004 WF when we were tickled to death to have our first 55k crowd since the climactic 1994 Grey Cup, we've made much of this tipping point-style sales pattern for playoff games, whereby sales gradually reach some critical mass beyond which people are supposedly buying tickets to be part of a huge crowd/event just as much as to watch the game. But I'd like to ask this question: have we really been seeing tipping point behaviour here?

How do we know for certain that all of these people who come only to the 40-50k playoff games are being influenced by the building crowd momentum? Isn't it just as likely, that some — perhaps even many or most — of these people already firmly decided that they would be attending almost from the day the playoff game was clinched? That they would be attending the game without giving much thought to how big the crowd would become (beyond knowing it would probably be the year's best) and that most of them just happened to procrastinate until the final few days on the matter of actually following through and buying their tickets?

If that's the case then the so-called tipping point is not really a true tipping point at all. Moreover, it would mean that the time width of the selling window — whether you clinch at the very end of the regular season or several weeks earlier — doesn't really matter. In this view, the size of the crowd is practically pre-determined, with people committing early on whether or not attend, with the follow-through of the buy coming much closer to game day. Thus, what might really be merely a reflection of human nature — the tendency to put things off until as late as possible, or nearly so — would become disguised as a case of crowd psychology.

So the question is, are these people trying to be part of any crowd that happens to materialise spontaneously, or are they simply procrastinators? Any thoughts?

[David]

I got an email from the Lions tonight saying that over 36,000 tickets have been sold and as a season ticketholder I can buy up to 8 tickets aside from my normal seats at the season ticket holder discounted rate ($37.25 in my case for the end zone). I had long ago bought 7 extras at this price before public sales of playoff tickets opened. I'm surprised they're still trying to flog discount offers to season ticketholders at this late stage.

Got the same email. Seems like the Lions are banking on season ticket holders to help them sell tickets.

There seems to be a bit of a diconnect here. My email tonight reads, "36,000 tickets have been sold...." Weren't we at that number on like, Monday morning? I take this to mean they were either fudging a bit on Monday to spark interest, or they're fudging a bit now to show STHs there's still a great selection of seats from which to choose.


DH

[J5V]

I got an email from the Lions tonight saying that over 36,000 tickets have been sold and as a season ticketholder I can buy up to 8 tickets aside from my normal seats at the season ticket holder discounted rate ($37.25 in my case for the end zone). I had long ago bought 7 extras at this price before public sales of playoff tickets opened. I'm surprised they're still trying to flog discount offers to season ticketholders at this late stage.

The rates for these tickets are as follows:

$37.25 as opposed to $46 for end-zone.
$47.25 as opposed to $56 for corners.
$67.25 as opposed to $78 for 0-20 yard lines.
$87.25 as opposed to $98 for 20 yard line to center field.

If every season ticket holder found 8 others to come to the game ... that would do it

[vanhalendlrband]

To me, it goes against all the facts going around right now, I think because its a non grey cup year you're going to have a huge Calgary and random fan turnout, including myself who isn't buying a ticket yet, trying to co-ordinate some friends to go, this really should sellout. I don't think the prices are that unreasonable and with the new stadium it really shouldn't be keeping anyone away and I think its sad this stadium hasn't been soldout every night.