Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

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Evil Empire
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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

Belize City Lion wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 10:38 pm
cms22 wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 10:35 pm how do things work with contracts in the CFL?

frankly, i think alot of the money we are playing high profile veterans (and sukh chung) could be better spent on younger players next year..........

i think the problems are so deep that i would get rid of almost every high paid veteran. even bryan burnham. maybe keep figueroa. and some canadians have looked ok.

basically i would get rid of reilly, willis, carter for sure if you don't have to pay them next year. not sure how the rules work and not sure all are signed for next season.

the big thing is reilly is old. and it seems like, for whatever reason, young CFL QB's have been alot better than years past.
At this point in the season most of veteran salaries are guaranteed for the remainder of the season. We may see a few young guys cut, but the vets are secure thanks to the SMS.
Ed Hervey has had many chances to make changes this season but has sat on his hands. Let alone the choice he made for head coach. I mean, I think Hervey is problem number 1 because of his ego. And the longer he does nothing the more incredible the situation seems to me. A good CFL GM doesn’t pray for NFL rejects. He has his squad set, and then looks to fill holes with NFL cuts. Preferably only due to injury.

In a league with an sms, there is no reason for this kind of record. Sure, teams lose their starting QB, etc. But Reilly has started and played almost every minute this year. I saw in the game thread that almost nobody mentioned how horrible Ham’s qb was. And their defence should have had at least 6 picks. That game honestly should never have been up for grabs.

I said it before. Ed Hervey was fired in Edmonton for a reason. Now he has made this whole season about trying to get revenge against Edmonton. That went out the window after game 3 of the season. A 50 record in futility. Do people honestly not see the problem starts with the GM, and has rolled downhill from there?

I feel bad for Lion fans, I honestly do. But, that guy IS your biggest problem. Mistake after mistake all aimed at getting even with the Eskimos. And the folks that don’t see the obvious problems with Claybrooks astound me. My 80 year old mother texted me tonight during the game, and her comments were bang on.

I said it before. RNG had very valid points. He just went about making them in the exact wrong way for this pc society. But, he wasn’t wrong.

And remember, my wife is black.


maxlion
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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

The coaching salary cap handcuffs Hervey. He could fire a coach, but would be prevented from hiring a replacement by the cap, so we would just be without a coach.


JohnnyMusso
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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

Evil Empire, though I did not mention Evans played a bad game, I did say Hamilton would not win the Grey Cup with him for he is not good enough. Their chances went out the window when Masoli got hurt. Evans has played bad last 2 games and yet they managed to get lucky and win both. Only reason they won tonight was due to the botched fake punt by the Lions.

I think many agree here that Ed Hervey is the main problem. If Lions manage to get sold before the season's end or the deal is close, both Hervey and Claybrooks will be fired. If there was no coaching cap in place Claybrooks would have been fired by now. He may be a good DC, but he is not a good HC and if Lions finish with 3 wins or less, he has to be fired and his final 2 years eaten. You cannot risk going through this again next season. Farhan L said on the radio the crowd tonight was the worst he has ever seen. Any prospective new owners know this and will clean house. If they are not sold who knows, but someone will take the fall for this bad season. I agree Hervey making minor changes from game to game was not enough. Last Bye, they had to make some major changes and he did nothing. He got Renfrow in a trade and he has played poorly last 2 games and was standing still for 1 sack when the Tiger Cat player blew past him.

Lions have their worst start since 1969 when their QB was the terrible Paul Brothers and the team lacked talent. They ended up winning 5 games. I doubt this team will win 5 games. I said it before I would not be surprised if they finish 1 and 17.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

maxlion wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:27 pm The coaching salary cap handcuffs Hervey. He could fire a coach, but would be prevented from hiring a replacement by the cap, so we would just be without a coach.
Heed those wise words above and be careful what you wish for. With his hands tied by the SMS, Hervey might decide to shuffle the deck chairs on the Titanic. Can you imagine Jarious Jackson as our HC with Claybrooks as DC?


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

Good teams steal wins. Bad teams give them away. The Lions gave another one away tonight, thanks to 3 costly turnovers that resulted in a minimum 13-point swing in a game decided by 3 points.

First and foremost was the decision to call a fake punt on third and 9 from the B.C. 36-yard line in a tie game early in the third quarter, and then fail to call it off when Hamilton adjusted. The Ticats had done nothing on offence up to that point. The play gained only 2 yards and the Ticats converted the turnover into their only touchdown of the game. DeVone Claybrooks said after the game that the fake was called off but the players ran it anyway. It shouldn’t have been called in the first place. Football games are won and lost on turnovers and momentum. That play that turned the game in Hamilton’s favour.

Mike Reilly compounded the turnover troubles by throwing 2 end-zone interceptions, likely costing the Lions at least 6 points and possibly more.

Add the 4 no-yards penalties for 60 yards taken by Anthony Thompson, the 4 penalties called on B.C.’s punt return team and the 7 sacks given up by the Lions (mostly on a 4-man rush against 6 blockers) and the Ticats had a huge advantage in starting field position all night.

The Lions have shown that they can play with any team in the league but they’re 1-9 and still finding new ways to lose.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

I am going to add one more point that seems to get overlooked.

Our punting is horrible. Bartel punts on the nose of the football. The ball goes end-over-end straight up in the and straight back down. 39.9 gross average. Sure, Thompson needs more discipline and awareness, but his punter did not help him out.



DH :cool:


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

JohnnyMusso wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 10:24 pm Thompson had 4 penalties on special teams. He should be cut.
I was watching him on one of the punts. Thompson was sprinting down the field with his head down totally oblivious to where the ball was. Interesting that one of the panelist on the post game mentioned that Thompson would be signed by another team within an hour if he was cut. I seem to recall that he was still unemployed when the Lions came calling after he was cut in training camp.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

maxlion wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:27 pm The coaching salary cap handcuffs Hervey. He could fire a coach, but would be prevented from hiring a replacement by the cap, so we would just be without a coach.
I think the league needs to revisit this coaches salary cap. As maxlion has stated it prevents the team from firing an incompetent coaches til the end of the season. The biggest losers are the fans who are saddled with poor team play week after week like Vancouver.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

Clearly this year is done and it’s time to start planning for next year. We need to start auditioning new players to see how they will play under game conditions and give them some experience.

If we don’t have a backup QB nows the time to start looking real hard for one. I am a Riley fan, but I don’t think letting him get pounded game in game out is doing him any favours either mentally of physically. Part of the problem is Riley is holding on to the ball for far too long, so that needs to be looked at by the coaches. Plays taking too long to develop? Receivers not running the proper routes? Players not understanding the play ( Riley appears to be directing traffic out there)! Riley lacking confidence? Could be lots of things, but the results are the same.

Team discipline needs to be addressed, we take far too many stupid penalties especially by, but not limited to special teams. Seems like ever punt or kickoff results in us getting flagged.

We were outplayed in every facet of the game, not just Special Teams! The only reason it even looked close was due to the poor offensive showing by Hamilton. Hamilton’s QB kept us in the game, not our bend then break defence! On offence we continue to make one the premiere QB’s in the League look awful. Overall this team looks like it has given up, so why not audition new members!


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

QB Club 63 wrote: Sun Aug 25, 2019 12:03 am
maxlion wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:27 pm The coaching salary cap handcuffs Hervey. He could fire a coach, but would be prevented from hiring a replacement by the cap, so we would just be without a coach.
Heed those wise words above and be careful what you wish for. With his hands tied by the SMS, Hervey might decide to shuffle the deck chairs on the Titanic. Can you imagine Jarious Jackson as our HC with Claybrooks as DC?
That's actually an intriguing thought. Remember Khari Jones as OC before him when everyone wanted him run out of town on a rail? How has that worked out for him? Yes it's a shot in the dark but JJ might just find his niche as HC.


VictoriaFan
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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

any one know the attendance? Looked pretty empty in there. Not that it would make any difference to the way the Lions are playing but officiating with Proulx was pretty crappy, missed offside, missed fumble, missed facemask on Reilly, hey its the only way we can move the ball is with penalties!


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

TheLionKing wrote: Sun Aug 25, 2019 1:09 am
maxlion wrote: Sat Aug 24, 2019 11:27 pm The coaching salary cap handcuffs Hervey. He could fire a coach, but would be prevented from hiring a replacement by the cap, so we would just be without a coach.
I think the league needs to revisit this coaches salary cap. As maxlion has stated it prevents the team from firing an incompetent coaches til the end of the season. The biggest losers are the fans who are saddled with poor team play week after week like Vancouver.
I could be wrong but I don't believe firing a coach after the season exonerates the team from whatever financial obligations that remain for said coach. In other words I think whatever or however any severance is to be paid moving forward still counts against future Ops Cap. It might all depend on what sort of language is written into the coach's contract covering dismissal. If there is an option for lump sum severance it might be best to bite that bullet this year. Teams get a partial mulligan because only team fines will be imposed if a team exceeds the cap. Starting in 2020 there is potential for loss of draft picks and fines against senior management.

Personally I'm very much against firing a HC or GM in mid-season. Doing so makes for replacing them with candidates from a very small pool of those either already on the team's staff or those currently out of work. This as opposed to filling in the offseason when the talent pool is much deeper. Also when a team fills a job with a person on an interim basis if the team responds positively by winning a few games or going close to .500 the interim guy usually gets the permanent position. More often than not his success turns out to be short lived and the team is considering firing him mid-season the next year or the year after.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

VictoriaFan wrote: Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:43 am any one know the attendance? Looked pretty empty in there.
Announced at 16,751, but undoubtedly somewhat lower than that.

Average announced attendance for the Lions 4 home games so far is 18,196, a figure probably inflated a little by the Saskatchewan crowd here for the Riders game.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

Hambone wrote: Sun Aug 25, 2019 9:51 am
Personally I'm very much against firing a HC or GM in mid-season. Doing so makes for replacing them with candidates from a very small pool of those either already on the team's staff or those currently out of work. This as opposed to filling in the offseason when the talent pool is much deeper. Also when a team fills a job with a person on an interim basis if the team responds positively by winning a few games or going close to .500 the interim guy usually gets the permanent position. More often than not his success turns out to be short lived and the team is considering firing him mid-season the next year or the year after.
It also means you're recycling fired coaches from other organizations.


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Re: Hamilton at B.C. Aug. 24, 2019 - Post Game Thread

To answer an earlier question yes the Lions did fire their HC Jim Champion mid-1969. Champion himself had been a mid-season appointment in 1967 replacing Dave Skrien who also had been a mid-season appointment back in 1961. GM Jackie Parker replaced Champion for 1-1/2 seasons before Eagle Keys was hired. Keys would be fired mid-1975 and replaced by Cal Murphy.

Other mid-season hires who would later leave mid-season include Larry Donovan, Greg Mohns and Steve Buratto.

Complete list:
https://stats.cfldb.ca/team/bc-lions/coaches/


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