If there were a change at OC....

[Sir Purrcival]

Who might be available/suitable to take that position right now?

I was kind of thinking that Rick Worman might be available, or perhaps although it wouldn't likely make sense for him, Matt Dunnigan.

What are some other possible names that people can think of?

[Lions4ever]

Pipe dream: Mike Leach

[Tighthead]

Pipe dream: Mike Leach

That may not be that crazy. He probably needs a few years away from the NCAA after the way things ended.

[WestCoastJoe]

Who might be available/suitable to take that position right now?

I was kind of thinking that Rick Worman might be available, or perhaps although it wouldn't likely make sense for him, Matt Dunnigan.

What are some other possible names that people can think of?

Not sure the Good Ship Lion is salvageable for this season.

Firing and replacing a football coach in midseason is so hard to do. Do you then change the playbook midseason? Just try to change the play calling? Ughhhh

Buratto was pushed out way back when for JC. Wally listened to his receivers in bringing JC back to the Lions for 2008. He then listened to JC in moving him down to the sideline, where he could be closer to the action. He then demoted Kruk. He then demoted Dorazio. All of this showing preferential treatment for JC. For Wally to abandon JC midseason would be surprising to say the least. So what is more amazing? Wally's loyalty to JC? Or the glacial pace at which Wally acknowledges reality and makes a tough decision?

Wally would need a very strong nudge from Braley to change his OC. I can't see him doing it on his own.

Worman would be a good candidate. But he would need a death wish to take the job, methinks.

Danny Maciocia? From the frying pan into the fire.

Back to Dorazio? Possible.

Dave Dickenson is unofficial OC in Calgary. How crazy would he have to be to come here for the OC job? If we are lucky he might take on the HC job here next year.
..........

We are also starting to show some leaks on defence too.

Ryan Phillips does not like contact, in a contact sport.

Tad Crawford looks lost.

Pittman is no playmaker, IMO.

Too many undisciplined penalties.

Still a reliance on a 3-man front, when pressure is called for.

[Lionut]

Changing the OC for the sake of making a change is stupid. It takes a long time to implement a new scheme and terminology - it would be like going back to camp. It would actually cause things to get worse, believe it or not. Changes like that needs to be made in the clear light of day, in the off season.

Let's be honest - this season is basically toast. What the team needs to focus on is personnel - getting some better skill in here, and then getting them signed for next year. After that, focus on drafting better - years of unproductive Canadian drafts have now come home to roost for the Lions. Remember the great Canadian receiving depth we had just a few years ago? So much for that. Remember what a beast Tyrone Williams was? Did we ever adequately replace Carl Kidd, for that matter? The list goes on and on. The Lions have suffered one personnel downgrade after another over the last few years, and now it has caught up to us.

It ain't about the plays, gang - its about the players.

[Rammer]

Changing the OC for the sake of making a change is stupid. It takes a long time to implement a new scheme and terminology - it would be like going back to camp. It would actually cause things to get worse, believe it or not. Changes like that needs to be made in the clear light of day, in the off season.

Let's be honest - this season is basically toast. What the team needs to focus on is personnel - getting some better skill in here, and then getting them signed for next year. After that, focus on drafting better - years of unproductive Canadian drafts have now come home to roost for the Lions. Remember the great Canadian receiving depth we had just a few years ago? So much for that. Remember what a beast Tyrone Williams was? Did we ever adequately replace Carl Kidd, for that matter? The list goes on and on. The Lions have suffered one personnel downgrade after another over the last few years, and now it has caught up to us.

It ain't about the plays, gang - its about the players.

Lionut where do you see our current roster as compare to the other CFL teams? I see us in 4th, given that, there are some issues with the plays.

You missed the departure of Otis Floyd, that seemed to expose Glatt for what he contributed in the middle.

As for the NI talent at receiver, perhaps there is a young stud that is available this off season, Lions look to be zeroed in on that. Of course, Wally will probably want to let him earn his stripes on ST for his three seasons in a Lions uniform, or place him on the PR for the taking.

[West Coast Blue Fan]

For weeks Chapedelaine has been the brunt of a lot of criticism, perhaps rightly so. Our offence is anemic.....at best.

Much of this, IMHO, has to be on the players, sure we have drops, take dumb penalties, run wrong routes etc, but it all starts with the O line. I find it hard to believe that all the focus is on Chapdelaine when Dorazio seems to get a pass by almost everyone.

For years, our O line has seen QB after QB go down to injury. We have seen it with one of the best QB's of late (Dickenson), we've seen it with Buck, Jarious, Casey, hell even Spergon Wynn. We've lost Murphy and Jimenez because they were un-coachable (according to media reports), Walter Stith brought in as the next "one"and subsequently released. 3 first or second round draft picks unable to hold their own (Valli, Sorenson and JHR), even though they have been "learning the system" a number of years. Wasted draft picks (Matt Morencie, Danny Watkins) Imports with impressive resumes from high end NCAA schools that have done little or nothing and the beat still continues. We have an undersized center who plays his ass off, coming off of injury and is getting long in the tooth. A chronically injured RG (Sherko), and the afore mentioned band of draft picks.

Sure, we've enjoyed some success with fewest sacks allowed or having our RB lead the league in rushing. But how much of that was because our RB was truly a great back or because Dickenson was a cerebral assassin when it came to finding the open receiver. We have also led the league in missed games dues to injury for our starting QBs. Coincidence? Bad luck? I think not.

Is it because Dorazio uses poor blocking schemes? Is he not able to judge talent (besides good girth)? I don't know anymore. But I do know that it doesn't matter who we line up under center if we can't execute the most basic part of the equation......and block.

We have used the rookie excuse, injury excuse, poor calls by Chap, Wally getting passed by....but again IMHO, much of the brunt needs to fall squarely on coach Dan Dorazio. Other than Angus, there is no emotion on that line, no swagger at all. Missed blocks, multiple penalties for holding, procedure and the topper for me....last night, Valli not even having a clue on the botched screen pass. All that lays squarely on the coach.

Time to move on Dan.

[WestCoastJoe]

For weeks Chapedelaine has been the brunt of a lot of criticism, perhaps rightly so. Our offence is anemic.....at best.

Much of this, IMHO, has to be on the players, sure we have drops, take dumb penalties, run wrong routes etc, but it all starts with the O line. I find it hard to believe that all the focus is on Chapdelaine when Dorazio seems to get a pass by almost everyone.

For years, our O line has seen QB after QB go down to injury. We have seen it with one of the best QB's of late (Dickenson), we've seen it with Buck, Jarious, Casey, hell even Spergon Wynn. We've lost Murphy and Jimenez because they were un-coachable (according to media reports), Walter Stith brought in as the next "one"and subsequently released. 3 first or second round draft picks unable to hold their own (Valli, Sorenson and JHR), even though they have been "learning the system" a number of years. Wasted draft picks (Matt Morencie, Danny Watkins) Imports with impressive resumes from high end NCAA schools that have done little or nothing and the beat still continues. We have an undersized center who plays his ass off, coming off of injury and is getting long in the tooth. A chronically injured RG (Sherko), and the afore mentioned band of draft picks.

Sure, we've enjoyed some success with fewest sacks allowed or having our RB lead the league in rushing. But how much of that was because our RB was truly a great back or because Dickenson was a cerebral assassin when it came to finding the open receiver. We have also led the league in missed games dues to injury for our starting QBs. Coincidence? Bad luck? I think not.

Is it because Dorazio uses poor blocking schemes? Is he not able to judge talent (besides good girth)? I don't know anymore. But I do know that it doesn't matter who we line up under center if we can't execute the most basic part of the equation......and block.

We have used the rookie excuse, injury excuse, poor calls by Chap, Wally getting passed by....but again IMHO, much of the brunt needs to fall squarely on coach Dan Dorazio. Other than Angus, there is no emotion on that line, no swagger at all. Missed blocks, multiple penalties for holding, procedure and the topper for me....last night, Valli not even having a clue on the botched screen pass. All that lays squarely on the coach.

Time to move on Dan.

Good post, WCBF.

I agree.

Dorazio is the Mad Scientist of O Line play. Move this one here. Move that one there. No ideas from the players allowed (Jimenez). Fill their heads with hundreds of concepts about footwork or hand fighting. Scare them to death. Valli is so scared he can't see straight. For years, our QBs have taken endless hits.

I cannot believe all of our high draft pick O Linemen are duds. Valli, JonHR, Sorensen, Jones. Rather than the players, much of it has to be on the coaching.

Some of it is play design and play calling. Some of it has to go to the O Line coach. Changing cast of characters with same result.

I have to wonder if Dorazio and Chapdelaine even work together well. Dorazio was demoted in favour of Chapdelaine. For most people that would put a damper on effective cooperation.

[Ravi]

While Dorazio's O-Line is the weak unit, I'd give him another chance as OC, he's really the only choice. He knows the plays and personelle. He could alter the schemes and game plan with more emphasis on the running game...while not throwing out the entire playbook which would be difficult at this time of season. If Dorazio couldn't improve the offence, then the Lions are fully justified in cleaning house in the off season.

I'd like to see the Lions go mostly to the traditional 2-back set. What good are 5 or 6 receivers when the QB has no time in the pocket? Maximum protection on passing plays while utilzing Davis, Lee and/or Messam in the running attack. Also Harris/Foster for Wilson and Black for Arseneux, who needs to watch for a few weeks.

I don't think that going to a two-back set is a good move at all. Mike Kelly did that last year in Winnipeg and it was a disaster. Sending only four receivers out with five DBs and at least a couple of linebackers dropping into coverage - with outside linebackers in the league now more or less being extra DBs themselves - would not work well at all IMO. There have to be better ways to get the likes of Davis, Lee and Messam involved in the offence.

[cromartie]

Changing the OC for the sake of making a change is stupid. It takes a long time to implement a new scheme and terminology - it would be like going back to camp. It would actually cause things to get worse, believe it or not. Changes like that needs to be made in the clear light of day, in the off season.

Let's be honest - this season is basically toast. What the team needs to focus on is personnel - getting some better skill in here, and then getting them signed for next year. After that, focus on drafting better - years of unproductive Canadian drafts have now come home to roost for the Lions. Remember the great Canadian receiving depth we had just a few years ago? So much for that. Remember what a beast Tyrone Williams was? Did we ever adequately replace Carl Kidd, for that matter? The list goes on and on. The Lions have suffered one personnel downgrade after another over the last few years, and now it has caught up to us.

It ain't about the plays, gang - its about the players.

Firing coordinators midseason is the true sign of a desperate coach, to be sure. It seldom works.

But plenty of it is about the plays, and to continue to not acknowledge this is tiresome. The Jarious/Printers model of QB and the Lulay/Pierce/Dickenson model of QB cannot run the same type of offense. They are fundamentally different types of players. The Cleveland Browns learned this when they tried to make Derek Anderson conform to an offense designed around Brady Quinn's strengths, ruining both QBs in the process, and costing the entire coaching staff their jobs. JCs coordination and management style simply does not adjust well either in game or from week to week, and there's six years of evidence to back this up. Steve Burrato was a poor Head Coach, but is a terrific coordinator. JC would probably be a very good CIS Head Coach, but as a spur of the moment thinker isn't really that good. Those are different management skill sets and approaches to the job that translate not only to football, but to almost any management position in or out of sports.

Your points on personnel aren't lost. Wally was painfully slow to acknowledge what was in plain sight for two seasons with Javi playing out of position and, in the process, lost a trifecta of solid players at the position that the club is just now beginning to replace. The offensive line, with the exception of the Rob Murphy years, has played pretty poorly since 2002. In fact, the only areas of the club that have managed to hold up fairly well are the secondary and the Defensive Line (save for Gary Butler). The lack of draft depth you cite is a good reason why Special Teams play has declined so rapidly and is just now beginning to rebound.

But enough already with "it's not the coaches". Coaches lose their players, lose their mojo, grow stale with their tendencies and lose their way. In case you haven't noticed, Mike Benevides gets to spend this season at the Rich Stubler re-education camp for blitzers. And at this point, JCs, and pretty well every other offensive coach, has lost their way. And if Wally keeps scapegoating the wrong players and hemorrhaging loses, fans and revenue as part of the process, he's likely to find himself promoted to a managerial role sooner than he'd like.

[TheZeppo]

Changing the OC for the sake of making a change is stupid. It takes a long time to implement a new scheme and terminology - it would be like going back to camp. It would actually cause things to get worse, believe it or not. Changes like that needs to be made in the clear light of day, in the off season.

Let's be honest - this season is basically toast. What the team needs to focus on is personnel - getting some better skill in here, and then getting them signed for next year. After that, focus on drafting better - years of unproductive Canadian drafts have now come home to roost for the Lions. Remember the great Canadian receiving depth we had just a few years ago? So much for that. Remember what a beast Tyrone Williams was? Did we ever adequately replace Carl Kidd, for that matter? The list goes on and on. The Lions have suffered one personnel downgrade after another over the last few years, and now it has caught up to us.

It ain't about the plays, gang - its about the players.

Exactly right. What we are seeing this year has been building for a while, and it has nothing to do with the
"schemes", the qualifications of the offensive coordinator, or the skills of either of the quarterbacks. As the previous
poster said, there has been a slow deterioration in the quality of players over the past two or three years, either due to aging, or a lack of skill in younger players who have been brought in to replace released veterans. This season, and likely the next,
are going to be difficult times for Lions' fans, as Buono and Shivers go about the business of trying to find guys who can play, and giving the young players who are now here time to develop their skills. To Buono and Shiver's credit, they have found some young
guys who they can build the B.C. defence around. However, I would expect many of the offensive linemen and receivers
who are now on the team to be gone by this time next year.

In Vancouver, we haven't had to go through a rebuilding period for a long time, but it is something that fans of all CFL teams
have had to endure at one time or another. In our case, the rebuilding period may take a while, as there are some serious personnel problems along the offensive line, especially at the tackle positions. As well, our veteran receivers have all lost a step or two, and,
painful as it may be to acknowledge, are on the downsides of their careers. It takes time to both find, and develop, players
who will be better than those already playing these positions, especially when non-import personnel are involved. What we are seeing right now, mostly on offence, is what rebuilding looks like. My advice is to get used to it for at least the remainder of this season, and through 2011.

[strait8]

Here is my 2 cents.

You look back and you see over the years the lions were solid gold in the Canadian talent department. For how many years did we actually start more Canadians than required by CFL rules. Not only that they were stellar as well.

Nit any more, we have squandered so many good Canadians, would Morencie be starting center if he were here and an orderly transition from Reid in place. Probably. Would matt Clarke be an option at wideout rather than the over 30 club we have in our Canadian wr today. Probably. So many choices squandered.

We have lost both american and Canadian talent to the NFL. All this weakens you. You can't replace all the pieces.

If you compare the job of finding talent it seems Canadian talent choices have gone down since benevides( formerly in charge of canadian talent) became DC.

To me on the talent level we have never been able to replace two key tough guys. Tyrone Williams who was so underrated that you did not notice how great he did his job and how he improved everybody around him a DT that makes over 70 tackles is almost unheard of. He made glatt look good. When he left Glatt became a turnstile punching tickets of the rb going past him.

The other was Jason clermont. He made the offense tough and he made the tough catch. You could see the offensive team and the defensive team be motivated by his courageous play.

Both these guys have been irreplaceable. I do not blame WB for moving on from them as they got older, I do blame him for not finding more character players to replace them.

On the offensive line we had Murphy who played tough for two years and the line played good. He did not after that and the line went down hill. RM seems to be having a great year in TO this year, being properly motivated by barker

Otis Floyd and Jamal Johnston. Wasted.I remember alondra Johnston after guest coaching here said JJ was the best line backer he had seen since he himself came in the league.

In my mind if WB steps out, there is no one on staff that could be HC. MB is really not the answer. Too young just yet.
Wb would be pulling the strings. I personally would go for Dave Ritchie. He fixes things fast by getting everybody to play their guts for him. That is a quality lacking in today's lions. You ask any former Lion who was the best coach ever it would be Ritchie. Passaglia played 25 years and called him the best coach of his career. He would get the right people in place to coach the offense and the team toughness and swagger would come back.

I am not certain that Dave Dickenson would not split the room as HC. Too soon for him to come back. Too many former teammates and relationships. Dunigan would come as HC never as OC. He makes more money doing his TSN gig and works less. I think that the chance to work with Buono would intrigue him if he were HC.




Also Wally's shadow would not be over DR they are on equal footing.

[West Coast Blue Fan]

Ritchie is almost 75, let it go. He's not coming back.