who still has their head in the sand

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KnowItAll
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http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2 ... t/8736743/

It is not a hoax. Unnatural climate change is happening due mainly, if not only, to human activity in this world, on this planet. Our kids, grandkids, great grandkids, are going to go through hell on earth from nature, because we did not get it, and get it long time ago, and do something along time ago

This really makes me see red, red, red. GRRRRRRRRRR

Those of us suffering the least from this may have to defend ourselves and our land against those who are suffering the worst. Other countries want BC farmland. Someday, things will be so bad elsewhere, they will come with guns.

Reducing climate change asap is way more important than jobs, economy, even health and education.

All pipelines thru BC should be denied. Existing ones closed down. Alberta should be forced to shut down the oil sands.
Use of fossil burning fuels must be 100% banned as of Jan 1, 2018. NO matter what it's present cost. If we must lose jobs, property and even in some cases our very lives, in order to start preserving the world for future generations as we should have been doing all along, then SO BE IT.

Did we really think we could just continue to abuse the world without serious consequences?
Every day that passes is one you can't get back
TheLionKing
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What really bugs me is the attitude of the Harper government regarding environmental issues. They have cut funding to the scientific community.
Blue In BC
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KnowItAll wrote:http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2 ... t/8736743/

It is not a hoax. Unnatural climate change is happening due mainly, if not only, to human activity in this world, on this planet. Our kids, grandkids, great grandkids, are going to go through hell on earth from nature, because we did not get it, and get it long time ago, and do something along time ago

This really makes me see red, red, red. GRRRRRRRRRR

Those of us suffering the least from this may have to defend ourselves and our land against those who are suffering the worst. Other countries want BC farmland. Someday, things will be so bad elsewhere, they will come with guns.

Reducing climate change asap is way more important than jobs, economy, even health and education.

All pipelines thru BC should be denied. Existing ones closed down. Alberta should be forced to shut down the oil sands.
Use of fossil burning fuels must be 100% banned as of Jan 1, 2018. NO matter what it's present cost. If we must lose jobs, property and even in some cases our very lives, in order to start preserving the world for future generations as we should have been doing all along, then SO BE IT.

Did we really think we could just continue to abuse the world without serious consequences?
I assume you've parked your vehicles, turned off your home heating. You're going to refuse to buy any goods ( food in particular ) which is produced further than walking distance from your home to avoid transportation of said goods by gas / diesel burning vehicles.

Of course you will no longer travel by any means besides foot, bicycle or horse.

Oh BTW. Stop using electricity since much of that has some fossil fuel use element to build or operate.

Got any workable solutions besides just turning everything off?
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Sir Purrcival
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I don't think anybody is prepared to give up on all those things but we can all take real steps to reduce and reuse. We are incredibly wasteful as a species.

Start with little things if bigger things are not possible. Weather stripping, led light bulbs in place of incandescent. Upgrade windows and appliances, improve insulation in the home. Turn the heat down, put on a sweater. How bout ditching one of the 3 cars sitting the driveway or sharing even just 1? How about just being more efficient about when you drive them doing several tasks at the same time? How bout growing a little garden to produce some products over the course of the year.

There are lots of things people could do and if we as a whole did some of those things, it would make a huge impact in terms of our consumption. It wouldn't hurt us to live with a bit less and spend a little more time and effort working for the things we do have.

There is no point in waiting for the other guy, the time to start is now. Lead by example, teach your kids how to do more with less and lets drop this obsession we seem to have with getting stuff.
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Blue In BC
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Of course things can and should be done. During the later part of my working career I worked in " green energy " products. Wind and Solar energy products etc etc.

I'm all for reducing waste and as you mentioned we are a very wasteful species. Humans impact the planet in many negative ways.

However, I get annoyed often by " complainers " that complain and then hop into their giant gas guzzling SUV's. Complaining is the easy part. Coming up with solutions even on a personal level is where I see less commitment.
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Sir Purrcival
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I know, I know. It is important that people put their money where their mouth is so to speak. But encouragement and example are good places to start. Getting educated about the kinds of things that are possible and passing that on is also a good thing. You sound like you have some experience in how to be greener. Maybe we could start a thread that people can share information and idea's on how to be greener. Experience has taught me that ideas can be from anywhere and even though they may be way out, they may also be brilliant.
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KnowItAll
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Blue In BC wrote:
KnowItAll wrote:http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2 ... t/8736743/

It is not a hoax. Unnatural climate change is happening due mainly, if not only, to human activity in this world, on this planet. Our kids, grandkids, great grandkids, are going to go through hell on earth from nature, because we did not get it, and get it long time ago, and do something along time ago

This really makes me see red, red, red. GRRRRRRRRRR

Those of us suffering the least from this may have to defend ourselves and our land against those who are suffering the worst. Other countries want BC farmland. Someday, things will be so bad elsewhere, they will come with guns.

Reducing climate change asap is way more important than jobs, economy, even health and education.

All pipelines thru BC should be denied. Existing ones closed down. Alberta should be forced to shut down the oil sands.
Use of fossil burning fuels must be 100% banned as of Jan 1, 2018. NO matter what it's present cost. If we must lose jobs, property and even in some cases our very lives, in order to start preserving the world for future generations as we should have been doing all along, then SO BE IT.

Did we really think we could just continue to abuse the world without serious consequences?
I assume you've parked your vehicles, turned off your home heating. You're going to refuse to buy any goods ( food in particular ) which is produced further than walking distance from your home to avoid transportation of said goods by gas / diesel burning vehicles.

Of course you will no longer travel by any means besides foot, bicycle or horse.

Oh BTW. Stop using electricity since much of that has some fossil fuel use element to build or operate.

Got any workable solutions besides just turning everything off?
invalid points. It is worthless for only a small percentage of the population to do these things. I am all for everyone having to do these things. They are building homes that do not need electricity or gas. If the only thing we did was burn wood, then it would be negligible. AS it is, I do not drive an SUV. My wife car pools with someone else to work using 2 small gas efficient cars. I drive an older car and only put on about 5000k per year. I would give that up in a second if everyone else had to. The reason I said Jan 1 2018 was that it would give people over 3.5 years to prepare, as opposed to just stopping everything right now.

If you are trying to function or reach a goal thru using a bad method, you should stop doing it right away regardless of whether or not you have an alternative solution.
Every day that passes is one you can't get back
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Sir Purrcival
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That is an over simplification. There are often solutions to problems which would be just lovely but that are simply not economically viable. What is the point of building a completely self-sufficient home if it so expensive that no on can afford to buy or build it. And as frustrating as it may be to feel that you are doing things in a vacuum and that no on else is on board, it isn't worthless. The truth is that change comes gradually. Think about the auto engines of today vs 40 years ago. They really aren't remotely similar beasts at all. Think about how much more we have started to recycle things. Used tires are being used for carports and sidewalks. Solar panels are becoming much more common especially in Sunny Climates as is Wind Power. When I first went to Hawaii in the 70's as a boy, there was no such thing as a solar panel or a wind turbine. Now they are common place. Same with southern Alberta. Wind turbines every where. All around the world, alternative sources of power are being examined and developed. Until such time as we can replace some of these non renewable energy sources, we will have to make due. We need to be better stewards of them which is something we haven't done well and sadly some parts of the world are much farther behind but just like every revolution, sometimes change starts with an idea. Sometimes it takes people awhile to figure stuff out and some never do but compare where we are in the conversation now to where we were just 20 years ago. Light years ahead IMO
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Blue In BC
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KnowItAll wrote:
Blue In BC wrote:
KnowItAll wrote:http://www.usatoday.com/story/weather/2 ... t/8736743/

It is not a hoax. Unnatural climate change is happening due mainly, if not only, to human activity in this world, on this planet. Our kids, grandkids, great grandkids, are going to go through hell on earth from nature, because we did not get it, and get it long time ago, and do something along time ago

This really makes me see red, red, red. GRRRRRRRRRR

Those of us suffering the least from this may have to defend ourselves and our land against those who are suffering the worst. Other countries want BC farmland. Someday, things will be so bad elsewhere, they will come with guns.

Reducing climate change asap is way more important than jobs, economy, even health and education.

All pipelines thru BC should be denied. Existing ones closed down. Alberta should be forced to shut down the oil sands.
Use of fossil burning fuels must be 100% banned as of Jan 1, 2018. NO matter what it's present cost. If we must lose jobs, property and even in some cases our very lives, in order to start preserving the world for future generations as we should have been doing all along, then SO BE IT.

Did we really think we could just continue to abuse the world without serious consequences?
I assume you've parked your vehicles, turned off your home heating. You're going to refuse to buy any goods ( food in particular ) which is produced further than walking distance from your home to avoid transportation of said goods by gas / diesel burning vehicles.

Of course you will no longer travel by any means besides foot, bicycle or horse.

Oh BTW. Stop using electricity since much of that has some fossil fuel use element to build or operate.

Got any workable solutions besides just turning everything off?
invalid points. It is worthless for only a small percentage of the population to do these things. I am all for everyone having to do these things. They are building homes that do not need electricity or gas. If the only thing we did was burn wood, then it would be negligible. AS it is, I do not drive an SUV. My wife car pools with someone else to work using 2 small gas efficient cars. I drive an older car and only put on about 5000k per year. I would give that up in a second if everyone else had to. The reason I said Jan 1 2018 was that it would give people over 3.5 years to prepare, as opposed to just stopping everything right now.

If you are trying to function or reach a goal thru using a bad method, you should stop doing it right away regardless of whether or not you have an alternative solution.
Talk is cheap. Everything we touch uses fossil fuel. Every product in your home and your life is made by and transported using fossil fuels.

Western society is the most wasterul. IIRC I read that is responsible for 80% of waste in the world.

Anyway, if you think the governments in the world can come together and find ways to eliminate all of things you want by 2018, I think unfortunately you are the one with your head in the sand.

Reality is that populations are growing and the use is increasing. That in turn is creating a very bad situation with the world polution. I can't fault your desire but you haven't really offered anything in the way of realistic solutions, only complaints.
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KnowItAll
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Sir Purrcival wrote:That is an over simplification. There are often solutions to problems which would be just lovely but that are simply not economically viable. What is the point of building a completely self-sufficient home if it so expensive that no on can afford to buy or build it. And as frustrating as it may be to feel that you are doing things in a vacuum and that no on else is on board, it isn't worthless. The truth is that change comes gradually. Think about the auto engines of today vs 40 years ago. They really aren't remotely similar beasts at all. Think about how much more we have started to recycle things. Used tires are being used for carports and sidewalks. Solar panels are becoming much more common especially in Sunny Climates as is Wind Power. When I first went to Hawaii in the 70's as a boy, there was no such thing as a solar panel or a wind turbine. Now they are common place. Same with southern Alberta. Wind turbines every where. All around the world, alternative sources of power are being examined and developed. Until such time as we can replace some of these non renewable energy sources, we will have to make due. We need to be better stewards of them which is something we haven't done well and sadly some parts of the world are much farther behind but just like every revolution, sometimes change starts with an idea. Sometimes it takes people awhile to figure stuff out and some never do but compare where we are in the conversation now to where we were just 20 years ago. Light years ahead IMO
yes, but at our present rate of "progress", we will be way too late.
Every day that passes is one you can't get back
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notahomer
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TheLionKing wrote:What really bugs me is the attitude of the Harper government regarding environmental issues. They have cut funding to the scientific community.

Its not just the Harper government AND environment issues. Canadian governments have been slashing research to areas like healthcare for at LEAST fifteen years now. Its a real nice vicious circle.

You need research to prove your healthcare provision works. Funding gets cut and soon your model of care is no longer funded since there is no research proving its efficacy. Who still does research and is willing to pay for it? Big Pharma. So expect more of your healthcare problems to be able to be fixed via some kind of meds, they are a big form of research being done.......
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