2011 Canadian federal election

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Which party will you vote for in the 41st Canadian General Election on May 2, 2011?

Poll ended at Wed May 04, 2011 11:30 pm

Conservative (Stephen Harper)
16
67%
Liberal (Michael Ignatieff)
4
17%
Bloc Québécois (Gilles Duceppe)
1
4%
New Democrat (Jack Layton)
3
13%
Green (Elizabeth May)
0
No votes
 
Total votes : 24

Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Sir Purrcival » Tue Apr 19, 2011 11:07 pm

I personally shudder at the prospect of a Conservative Majority. Mr. Harper and his approach to democracy is more American that anything he accuses Iggy of being.

But this is not just something based on feelings so here are some of my reasons for not wanting Mr. Harper.

His economic policies.

What exactly are his policies? He has taken a lot of credit for Canada weathering the recession storm better than many other countries. Problem is that many of the rules that governed the financial sector in this country were Paul Martin's. It wasn't Mr. Harper who went from, "there will be no deficit", to a "there will be a small deficit" to "we will be in deficit until at least 2015. Even a blind mole could tell you that when your major trading partner is falling apart at the seams that trouble is going follow into our resource and manufacturing sectors. Apparently he and his finance minister couldn't which either makes them extremely thick or worse, outright liars.

Now he wants to drop Corporate tax rates "Again" to 15%. How about lowering the GST or personal income tax instead. Better yet, leave it alone for now. We are competitive among G8 countries and frankly, we are in deficit so now is not the time to get all generous with corporations when the average Canadian is trying to make ends meet. Put the money towards, Health Care or Education or even improved benefits for Seniors. All Canadians would stand to benefit from measures in those areas.

His fear mongering. - ah yes, the dreaded coalition, his version of the "red menace". Funny how a coalition didn't seem to be too bothersome when he was involved with a possible collaboration with the NDP and the dreaded Bloc. But now that the shoe is on the other foot, well, that is just plain undemocratic. I would prefer a coalition to his style of government. Nobody could get too out of line and pull the kind of undemocratic crap he tries to pull.

How about:
The 5 question a day policy that his team put together for this campaign. It is campaign, if you don't want to answer questions, you are in the wrong business.

Proroguing parliament twice to avoid loosing his grip on the government. Each time he has done that, many worthy bills have died in parliament. Great for getting things done. Parliamentary rules aren't' meant to be a way to avoid scrutiny or punishment for your misdeeds. He has done it twice, and that is twice too many.

Contempt of parliament. - this is a good one. How badly do you have to misuse power to get this. Apparently you have to go out of your way to ignore or delay requests for information pertaining to costs for Prisons and Fighter Jets. Mr. Harper claims that it is just the opposition ganging up on him. If this is so, then how come it has never happened in the history of this country up till now? I think it takes something special to be so honoured.

While we're at it. Lets talk fighter jets. First of all, for F-35 Supporters, a question. Would you buy a car that was a. still under development b. untested in real life and c. the cost of which you don't know? That is essentially the approach of Mr. Harper. Now lets hearken back to the heady days of the CF-18. When they were purchased, they were already deployed, had a known price tag and not the only jet fighter that was examined. See a difference? Even if these jets are ready for 2016, it will still be years before they have the bugs worked out of them. They are extremely complex aircraft. There are two roles that we use military equipment for, domestic defense and military collaborations of a peace keeping nature. It terms of domestic defense, against who? Our biggest threat is likely to be our good neighbours to the south. If that is the case, then A. They will have way more resources to expend against us than 50 jets are going to help with and B. they will have the same jets so technologically we would have no advantage anyway. Peacekeeping? this is a first strike capable aircraft with stealth properties. Who are we going to be using it against? The Libyans, the Afghan's, the Somali's. Chances are that we will never need the extremely expensive and complex abilities of this aircraft nor do we know they will work well in our harsher northern climate. I don't deny that as a pure flying machine, they have a lot of potential, but is that worth the risk of billions and billions of dollars over the next 30 years without so much as a look at what else may be on the market? In the end, it may be that the F-35 is the right jet for the job but until it is fully operational (they are still 5 years away at least), then maybe we should be looking at something else even if it means getting a smaller amount of different planes now and stretching out the CF-18's time in the air.

We can also talk about government misconduct - wonder if Lisa Raitt finds the events in Japan "sexy"
or would Bev Oda be ok if we decided to follow her example of altering contracts after they are signed. Where was Mr. Harper's indignation on that fundamental requirement of honouring a contract.
How about monies slated for border crossing improvement s going to a Conservative riding improperly

There are a lot of things but frankly I don't trust any of the parties with Majority power at this point but I find Mr. Harper tries to insult my intelligence by warning us about the "other guys" when in fact he has been just as "undemocratic" and fast and loose with the truth as his opponents". Their CRAP party smells as bad if not worse than the other guys.

And for the record. I have voted for many different parties over the years including the Conservatives of old, the Liberals and even the NDP. I am not partisan but the conduct of the Harper edition of the PCC has me sufficiently worried to urge people to think long and hard before voting for them.

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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby MacNews » Wed Apr 20, 2011 1:13 am

Sir Purrcival wrote:Now he wants to drop Corporate tax rates "Again" to 15%. How about lowering the GST or personal income tax instead. Better yet, leave it alone for now.

Proroguing parliament twice to avoid loosing his grip on the government. Each time he has done that, many worthy bills have died in parliament. Great for getting things done. Parliamentary rules aren't' meant to be a way to avoid scrutiny or punishment for your misdeeds. He has done it twice, and that is twice too many.

Contempt of parliament. - this is a good one. How badly do you have to misuse power to get this. Apparently you have to go out of your way to ignore or del


You want the GST reduced instead of the corporate income tax. Why? The GST has been cut from 7% to 5%, despite the Liberals best efforts. What we really need right now is more jobs, and cutting the corporate income tax will do that. Why would you want to 'leave it alone'? Do you not want...more jobs?

Chretien prorogued parliament 6 times. It has been done before, and it will be done again. Enough said on that topic.

All 'contempt' of parliament proves is that the opposition parties don't like the Conservatives, except most people already knew that.
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Sir Purrcival » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:05 am

You need to demonstrate conclusively that cutting corporate tax rates are going to create more jobs. They are gambling 6 Billion dollars in revenue that they are going to. The tax rate has already been cut twice recently. Those rates are already very competitive with other industrialized nations. By cutting them, you are taking 6 billion dollars away during a period of federal deficit. It is too generous in my books. If you have to cut 6 billion dollars out of the budget, then maybe it would be nicer to take it off the taxes they collect from the average Canadian. To paraphrase your jobs comment, how is this. "Less personal taxes = more money in your pocket = more disposable income = greater consumerism and a better corporate bottom line and better employment prospects". Can you tell me that a large portion of the 6 billion dollar savings to corporations aren't going to end up in the hands of a relatively small portion of executives and shareholders. Giving a tax break does not automatically translate to jobs. You have to have a consumer able to absorb product for the economy to run. Your other alternative is to do nothing to the tax rate. Give that six billion dollars to areas of need that I mentioned earlier or perhaps even apply it directly to the deficit. I would go along with a corporate tax cut if our rates were way out of line with other nations or it had been a long time since this was done. Neither of those apply here.
Last edited by Sir Purrcival on Wed Apr 20, 2011 11:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby WestCoastJoe » Wed Apr 20, 2011 10:37 am

We all have our opinions on the economy. And economists can use statistics to support any side of an argument you want. No wonder it is called the "dismal science." It was my major in university. Some of it was interesting. Most of it was boring.

The opinions of anybody living in a country have validity, not just the opinions of the economists and mandarins of the government. Living in a country, paying taxes, buying products, seeing the decisions of our government give us a real experience of economics.

In regard to cutting corporate taxes, I have to agree that there is no guarantee of a "trickle down" effect to more jobs. It would seem to have as much likelihood or more of ending up in the pockets of the executives. And I refer to no statistics to support this view. If brokerages and banks get tax cuts, does that translate into more jobs? Not necessarily.

If retail stores, as an example of corporations that employ vast numbers of workers, are given tax cuts, does that translate into more workers? Not sure that it does. Sales growth might translate into more jobs. Do tax cuts for corporations mean sales growth? Not necessarily.

In general, I support tax cuts. In general, I support the concept of smaller government. Sad to say, however, it seems that the fat cats, the rich and the corporations, get the cuts before the less wealthy members of our society. That is "dismal."
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby pennw » Thu Apr 21, 2011 5:00 pm

Hoping for Conservative Majority too . The results of this poll would be nice in the election itself . Majority would be the only way to get the government smartened up . Would be a good way to send a message to self-serving politicians like Ignatieff and Layton , that calling for an election because you smell opportunity is not exceptable .
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Toppy Vann » Thu Apr 21, 2011 9:15 pm

MacNews wrote:
Sir Purrcival wrote:Now he wants to drop Corporate tax rates "Again" to 15%. How about lowering the GST or personal income tax instead. Better yet, leave it alone for now.

Proroguing parliament twice to avoid loosing his grip on the government. Each time he has done that, many worthy bills have died in parliament. Great for getting things done. Parliamentary rules aren't' meant to be a way to avoid scrutiny or punishment for your misdeeds. He has done it twice, and that is twice too many.

Contempt of parliament. - this is a good one. How badly do you have to misuse power to get this. Apparently you have to go out of your way to ignore or del


You want the GST reduced instead of the corporate income tax. Why? The GST has been cut from 7% to 5%, despite the Liberals best efforts. What we really need right now is more jobs, and cutting the corporate income tax will do that. Why would you want to 'leave it alone'? Do you not want...more jobs?

Chretien prorogued parliament 6 times. It has been done before, and it will be done again. Enough said on that topic.

All 'contempt' of parliament proves is that the opposition parties don't like the Conservatives, except most people already knew that.


That is the problem with the current gov't. They don't even listen to Conservative economists who agree that income taxes are far less fair than consumption taxes (as long as they don't tax food and life necessities). GST should not have been cut but income taxes, yes.

You must have a competitive corporation tax regime (especially for small business) but not at the expense of lower income families (I am in the highest Canadian income tax bracket so I am just fine). There is not a lot of correlation between cutting business taxes for major corporations and job creation - that just does not happen like it used to as capital is fluid and keeps moving to lower cost producing areas. I am sitting in air polluted Hong Kong typing this. As I said yesterday to one client the air will be far better in 10 to 15 years as the old factories close and the jobs move west and inland China from the Pearl River Delta to where big business can get it done cheaper and where it is a new untapped labour force.

Big business don't exactly pay a lot of taxes - not sure what kind of job level MacNews has reached yet but these are the facts.

While Paul Martin as Min. of Finance got a lot of credit for the budget and the well being of Canada's finances the real credit should go to a former Min. of Finance and then Prime Minister, Jean Chretien. He was the reason for Canada's finances being great under Martin as we all saw how inept a leader Paul Martin was when he became PM. His folks took over the Liberal Party of Canada and forced Jean Chretien from office for the Quebec sponsorship scandal which is a paltry few millions compared to the Conservatives just spending $50 million in ONE of their ridings recently.

This Conservative gov't is the most hands on since Mackenzie King was in directing money to their own ridings and not all in the best interests or fairness to Canadians. This is not just the word among the federal staffers it is well documented by federal bureaucrats.

The Tories have squandered in binge spending of what was earned off the backs of the taxpayers.

Even right wingers like the Canadian Taxpayers Fed and Mr. Harper's cronies the National Citizen's Coalition have little good to say about Mr. Harper buying votes with tax payers dollars:

http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2 ... 62106.html

Tory spending hardly conservative

PETER ZIMONJIC , QMI Agency

First posted: Sunday, February 28, 2010

"In the last two years the Conservatives have been anything but fiscally conservative," says Kevin Gaudet, the federation's federal director. "The least they could do is just keep spending at the same level."

But that appears unlikely as well. According to the government's own figures, program spending will increase from $242 billion in 2009/10 to $261 billion in 2014-15.


http://www.torontosun.com/news/canada/2 ... 62106.html
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby zark » Fri Apr 22, 2011 5:25 pm

pennw wrote:Hoping for Conservative Majority too . The results of this poll would be nice in the election itself . Majority would be the only way to get the government smartened up . Would be a good way to send a message to self-serving politicians like Ignatieff and Layton , that calling for an election because you smell opportunity is not exceptable .

Where the hell did you get that from. The more I listen to Jack - boot Conservatives, the less likely I'll vote for them.Self serving???? and Harper isn't? "
The reason for an opposition party is to keep the governing party in check. Every one now knows that Harper can't work with other parties in an intelligent manner.Thank heaven he's only got a minority gov't. Little Stephen is unable to work well with the other members who were elected as well.
Can you just pay attention to the issues. Partisan politics is for zombies. Everything Harper(I wish I was an American) does is based on USA style politics. The attack ads especially. Debate is important, and that's why Harper has told his people not to go to any more debates.

Rid yourself of party politics. Don't look at the leader. Look at the policies. Make an intelligent vote. The "I hate Liberals because Harper told me to" just doesn't cut it.

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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Toppy Vann » Sat Apr 23, 2011 7:09 am

zark wrote:
pennw wrote:Hoping for Conservative Majority too . The results of this poll would be nice in the election itself . Majority would be the only way to get the government smartened up . Would be a good way to send a message to self-serving politicians like Ignatieff and Layton , that calling for an election because you smell opportunity is not exceptable .

Where the hell did you get that from. The more I listen to Jack - boot Conservatives, the less likely I'll vote for them.Self serving???? and Harper isn't? "
The reason for an opposition party is to keep the governing party in check. Every one now knows that Harper can't work with other parties in an intelligent manner.Thank heaven he's only got a minority gov't. Little Stephen is unable to work well with the other members who were elected as well.
Can you just pay attention to the issues. Partisan politics is for zombies. Everything Harper(I wish I was an American) does is based on USA style politics. The attack ads especially. Debate is important, and that's why Harper has told his people not to go to any more debates.

Rid yourself of party politics. Don't look at the leader. Look at the policies. Make an intelligent vote. The "I hate Liberals because Harper told me to" just doesn't cut it.

:beer:


While I never thought on this site that I'd be saying zark was right on but on politics he is.

I have been a member of the Conservatives as a youth and later a Liberal. Now that I am 65 and have NO financial worries for my wife and I for the rest of our lives I look at what gov'ts are doing and how it impacts our family and grandchildren and I do not just echo party views without thinking or some analysis.

If we all rid ourselves of voting for biases this country and our people would be far better off than we are now. For me, I've made it. I have pensions coming out of the ying yang - all guaranteed - and all of the benefits Canada has to offer as well as my current gig - CEO of a Hong Kong based company. I just want Canadians younger than me to do as well as I have done.

Vote as zark is saying on the policies.


The sad thing - the people this US style politics attracts to run these days are not all the right ones.
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby pennw » Sat Apr 23, 2011 10:39 am

Zark , i could just flip your comment back to you in reverse. The Liberals have done nothing that hasn't been out of partisanship. The only reason we are having an election at all is because Layton and Ignatieff both have purely selfish motives in calling it , and it was they who called it . They tried to pin the blame on Harper for calling it , but it was they who called it , there was no reason for an election at this point at all . They have steadily blamed Harper for not working with the other parties while they themselves have shown no co-operation on anything . It is the masses who eat up the ( partisan ) nonsense the Liberals spin that need to get their heads out of the sand .
The Libs and NDP have been chomping at the bit to call an election for a couple of years now and tried to bring in that coalition until they got a big back lash in the polls for doing so . And since then they have only been biding their time to call another premature election . They never had any intention on working with Government ever . Their tactic has been to not co-operate ever and always spin it that it was Harper not able to work with them . Now they've made their move and sadly many people have eaten up their rhetoric . Best thing would be for that to back fire .
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby zark » Mon Apr 25, 2011 5:12 pm

Just vote.
As Iggy said in Sudbury! Rise up and vote. Rise up canucks and vote!
No more apathy.

When did graduating from prestigious Universities become a bad thing. Then coming back to your roots to serve Canadians. Shrugging off attack ads. Is there any one here who can look at what a politician goes through and think that they could do that? Why have the Conservatives been broadcasting American style attack ads months before the Liberals "instigated election???".I read facts. Then I make my decision. Partisan politics is for old people.
Rise up and vote.
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Sir Purrcival » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:19 pm

MacNews wrote:
Sir Purrcival wrote:Now he wants to drop Corporate tax rates "Again" to 15%. How about lowering the GST or personal income tax instead. Better yet, leave it alone for now.

Proroguing parliament twice to avoid loosing his grip on the government. Each time he has done that, many worthy bills have died in parliament. Great for getting things done. Parliamentary rules aren't' meant to be a way to avoid scrutiny or punishment for your misdeeds. He has done it twice, and that is twice too many.

Contempt of parliament. - this is a good one. How badly do you have to misuse power to get this. Apparently you have to go out of your way to ignore or del


You want the GST reduced instead of the corporate income tax. Why? The GST has been cut from 7% to 5%, despite the Liberals best efforts. What we really need right now is more jobs, and cutting the corporate income tax will do that. Why would you want to 'leave it alone'? Do you not want...more jobs?

Chretien prorogued parliament 6 times. It has been done before, and it will be done again. Enough said on that topic.

All 'contempt' of parliament proves is that the opposition parties don't like the Conservatives, except most people already knew that.



Just so you know, proroguing a parliament is nothing new but generally it is done when a legislative session is near the end of completion and for a short period of time. The original purpose of prorogue was to end a legislative session to allow MP's to return to home ridings and conduct such business as required. It is still largely meant to signal an end to a legislative session and force a close when the bulk of business is completed. It has (to my knowledge) never been used in the past to avoid votes on confidence motions and for the prolonged periods that Mr. Harper has used it for. And by the by, Jean Chretian had majority governments. He did not use prorogue to maintain a grip of control. Every bill that is active in a legislative session starts from scratch again after prorogue. 36 of them last time including many of Harper's so called "crack down on crime" bills. Any and all committee also get tossed on the dung heap and have to start from scratch including those that are tasked with scrutinizing government. The man has been dancing on a head of pin trying to stay in power. What I have trouble understanding is why some of the things he has done haven't cause more ripples of concern with ordinary Canadians. He plays fast and loose with the truth but he isn't particularly good at it, he has misused the policies of "responsible government" to maintain a grip on power and that should be a concern for all Canadians.

You could argue that the "Contempt" citation is just other parties not liking Mr. Harper or his party. When have opposition parties ever liked their counterparts? That being so, not one of any previous minority governments has ever earned such an overwhelming symbol of disapproval. That speaks volumes.

If I am wrong, he will get his majority. The "trust" factor of Canadians will speak for itself on election day. I have no idea what the result is going to be but I know what I am not hoping for.
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby WestCoastJoe » Mon Apr 25, 2011 7:30 pm

At this time, I expect Harper's team to win.

As is often the case, my vote may well go to to a losing party.

That would not bother me too much. If Harper were to win, I would prefer that he not have a majority. The scariest part of his party to me is the influence of the more radical element, which seems to be centralized in Alberta. I can't help but think that Alberta is like Texas North. Oil, cows, cowboys, and radically conservative politics.

As I have indicated, at different times, with different leaders, with different issues, and sometimes federally, or provincially, I have voted at both ends and the middle of the political spectrum. I do try to keep an open mind and consider the situation each time with a fresh perspective.

Just IMO ...
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby Robbie » Tue Apr 26, 2011 12:49 pm

zark wrote:Just vote.
As Iggy said in Sudbury! Rise up and vote. Rise up canucks and vote!
No more apathy.
Rise up and vote.

:whs:
What will the voter turnout rate be this time? Any improvement from the pitiful 58.8% from 2008 would be a good start. Better yet if it can exceed the surprisingly high turnout in 2006.

1984 - 75.3%
1988 - 75.3%
1993 - 69.6%
1997 - 67.0%
2000 - 61.3%
2004 - 60.9%
2006 - 64.7%
2008 - 58.8%
祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪和溫哥華白帽女子隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。

改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。

幸福和繁榮的馬年。

恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby KnowItAll » Tue Apr 26, 2011 4:00 pm

Robbie wrote:
zark wrote:Just vote.
As Iggy said in Sudbury! Rise up and vote. Rise up canucks and vote!
No more apathy.
Rise up and vote.

:whs:
What will the voter turnout rate be this time? Any improvement from the pitiful 58.8% from 2008 would be a good start. Better yet if it can exceed the surprisingly high turnout in 2006.

1984 - 75.3%
1988 - 75.3%
1993 - 69.6%
1997 - 67.0%
2000 - 61.3%
2004 - 60.9%
2006 - 64.7%
2008 - 58.8%

considering how much most did not want this election, wouldnt be surprised to see less that 50%
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Re: 2011 Canadian federal election

Postby zark » Tue Apr 26, 2011 5:51 pm

So, do you think that voters should be forced to vote? they do it in Australia. I'm not sure , but I think they get fined fifty dollars.There are people out there that use the excuse of ..."not voting is making a statement". To me , it means you're fat and lazy, but that's just my opinion.
Just go out and vote.
I don't think Harper will get his majority, so expect things to get worse. Another election within 2 yrs. Harper does not play well with the other children, and he doesn't talk to media.
That fighter jet project of his is sounding dumber.
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