Football Operations: Ed Hervey - GM, Wally Buono - VP and HC

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WestCoastJoe
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:27 pm

I think our senses are numbed by all of the uncertainty, the hanging of hopes.

One thing is settled. Braley stays as owner. (Separate thread)

viewtopic.php?f=2&t=28777

General Manager? We don't know. Wally does not know. Wally stays? Wally goes? Best scenario for me --> Wally suggests to Braley that Neil McAvoy, Wally's long time assistant, take over as GM. I think that would tend to give some new life to the football operations.

Head Coach? We don't know. Wally? Mark? Someone from outside?

Coordinators? If Wally stays as Head Coach, I cannot see him cutting Mark W loose. Players such as Burnham have expressed support for Khari Jones. This fan could see them both back. DC and OC.

O Line? 14 years with Dan Dorazio as Wally's O Line coach here. I could not see that changing.

STs? I could see Wally making a change there. But some think Wally is the actual ST coach anyway. That is where he has traditionally gotten most involved in practice. After the year we had, I would expect Wally to make at least some changes to the staff.

My opinion? Start at the top.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

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WestCoastJoe
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:40 pm

Football operations ...

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John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

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WestCoastJoe
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:41 pm

Assistants ...

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John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

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Hambone
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 2:46 pm

In my frequently erroneous opinion I think Wally will remove some hats. Question is how many? I think he will remove them in bottom-up order on the org chart. HC will be the first tossed aside. He's already said that if he doesn't coach another game it won't break his heart. Next hat to go would be GM. If he is to wear only one hat next year I think it would be VP Football Ops. I'd put odds of HC only as an extreme longshot.
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B.C.FAN
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 3:56 pm

I'd love to see Wally step aside and enjoy retirement but I'm becoming less convinced that he will do that. His pride and loyalty won't let him leave when the team is down and needs leadership. Even his wife has said she can't see him leaving with unfinished business, or words to that effect.

The problem with Wally stepping down now is that the future of the organization remains uncertain. It would be hard to recruit a top-level coach, knowing that the team will likely be under new ownership in a year. And promoting an assistant such as Mark Washington just invites comparisons to the failed Mike Benevides experiment. I would rather have Wally remain as head coach than have him look over the shoulder of Washington as he did with Benevides.
"I think [Fred Fateri] was like a lot of people who watch football, hockey or any professional sport on television. They sit there and think they could coach better than the professional. Some people really think that." - Bob Ackles, The Water Boy

JohnnyMusso
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 4:14 pm

I think Wally will at least be the GM next year. Maybe coach. If new owners come in a year or so, they will likely clean house, so if Washington got the job it would be only for a year likely and then he would be fired by the new owners. So maybe Wally will stay, but he may not want to go through another possible tough year.

My bet is he gives up coaching and remains the GM.

As for the assistants, maybe Dorazio will retire. But my bet is they fire the defensive line coach, Ross, and the special teams coordinator. Marcel B leaves for Montreal and the rest are back. But maybe Jones will be gone. The players are not going to bad mouth anyone publicly I think.

maxlion
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Tue Nov 07, 2017 6:07 pm

I expect that we will see plenty of turnover in the coaching ranks based on Wally's history and Braley's recent comments.

My predictions based solely on hunches:

Wally as VP will stay.
GM: 50% chance reins handed to McEvoy
Coach: 0% chance Wally returns. Very unlikely that Washington is given the job. Only internal candidate is Bellefeuille (would not be my first choice).
DC: 10% chance Washington returns. I would be surprised but not out of the realm of possibility.
OC: 50% chance Jones returns.
ST: 0% chance Simmons returns.
Dorazio will retire.

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WestCoastJoe
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Wed Nov 08, 2017 2:55 am

Saw this article on cfl.ca. From Marshall Ferguson. Very interesting to me.

Gonna put it in this thread as it relates to coaching, and, indeed, to the opening we might have here.

https://www.cfl.ca/2017/11/06/ferguson- ... -hamilton/

It is about the effect June Jones had on the Hamilton TiCats, and in particular, Jeremiah Masoli and Brandon Banks.
I asked June Jones about the play Saturday morning at Tiger-Cats locker room clean out.

“It’s been around for a while and I’ve used similar stuff for a long time but never that exact concept, and of course with the extra guy up here (Canada) it’s changed even more from when we used to call it. Jeremiah (Masoli) and Brandon (Banks) started messing around with it a couple weeks ago and I liked it so we kept it ready”.

This is the beauty of Jones coaching from the outside looking in. He appears to let players play and any good idea is judged on its merit not its source of origin.
I asked Masoli Saturday about how the concept came to life in Hamilton and he echoed Jones, saying “I used to run it at Oregon and we had a slant there (from Brandon) but in practice about a month ago we started trying some different stuff and I just told him (Banks) to stay out there because he’s so dangerous in space.”
I went back in the football highlight time machine that is YouTube with Masoli Saturday morning before he returns home to California for the off-season and discussed what allowed him to have so much success in the second half of the season. Jeremiah pulled up clips from 2008 against Arizona where he ran this concept or that one, which reminded him of another thing, and then another.

It went on and on, the whole time Masoli speaking with an enthusiasm unlike a man eliminated from the playoffs who won’t play a meaningful snap for over six months.

By being paired with a coach with deep-rooted college football qualities, Masoli has been able to re-create the dynamic college player he was nearly a decade ago.
I asked if that free-wheeling, on-the-fly decision-making, risk-taking style is a normal thing that June Jones accepts from his quarterback, to which Masoli replied with a sentence that confirmed my previous belief that both Masoli (free agent) and Jones (not under contract) NEED to be back in 2018.

“He (Jones) just wants us to make plays, doesn’t really care how. If I mess that up, of course he wouldn’t be happy, but he knows I’ll make more good plays than bad ones when given the chance.”

The chance and a coach who believes in him. It’s all Jeremiah Masoli appears to need in order to succeed the way he did statistically in the second half of 2017.
When the ideas work on the field, the players buy in. These two professional, veteran players look like kids having fun playing football with their new coach.

2017-11-08_0232.png
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John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

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WestCoastJoe
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Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:00 am

Not suggesting this play for us, although it is possible. It is more about the possibilities of creative, innovative, inspirational, risk-taking coaching, and the effect that can have on a player and a team.

Great article by Marshall Ferguson. :thup:

By the way, Jones is not under contract. Hmmmmm ...

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Once again, Jones is not under contract. We should be so lucky as to get him here. Not likely, methinks. And I think Hamilton signs him once again, unless they are brain-dead.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

B.C.FAN
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Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:33 am

WestCoastJoe wrote:
Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:00 am
Not suggesting this play for us, although it is possible. It is more about the possibilities of creative, innovative, inspirational, risk-taking coaching, and the effect that can have on a player and a team.

Great article by Marshall Ferguson. :thup:

By the way, Jones is not under contract. Hmmmmm ...


2017-11-08_0258.png


2017-11-08_0258_001.png

Once again, Jones is not under contract. We should be so lucky as to get him here. Not likely, methinks. And I think Hamilton signs him once again, unless they are brain-dead.
I marvelled at the play when I saw it on the weekend, and was happy to read Ferguson’s detailed article about its origins, with video. The Lions could use some fresh ideas on offence, defence and special teams.
"I think [Fred Fateri] was like a lot of people who watch football, hockey or any professional sport on television. They sit there and think they could coach better than the professional. Some people really think that." - Bob Ackles, The Water Boy

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WestCoastJoe
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Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:49 am

B.C.FAN wrote:
Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:33 am
WestCoastJoe wrote:
Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:00 am
Not suggesting this play for us, although it is possible. It is more about the possibilities of creative, innovative, inspirational, risk-taking coaching, and the effect that can have on a player and a team.

Great article by Marshall Ferguson. :thup:

By the way, Jones is not under contract. Hmmmmm ...


2017-11-08_0258.png


2017-11-08_0258_001.png

Once again, Jones is not under contract. We should be so lucky as to get him here. Not likely, methinks. And I think Hamilton signs him once again, unless they are brain-dead.
I marvelled at the play when I saw it on the weekend, and was happy to read Ferguson’s detailed article about its origins, with video. The Lions could use some fresh ideas on offence, defence and special teams.
Yes, even veteran fans such as you and I can marvel at innovative ideas. And of course professional players such as Masoli and Banks can be inspired as well.

We could see the vastly improved play of the TiCats under Jones. This article gives us a look inside, how the coach works, how it translates to the field, and how it affects the players. Jones does not have the look of a locker room speech guy, but his players can see the power of his play designs.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.

Blitz
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Thu Nov 09, 2017 5:52 am

I believe Buono will be back as both GM and Head Coach. I believe Buono will be back as Head Coach for one reason only...he won't leave the game with our Leos finishing out of the playoffs for the first time in 21 seasons.

It will be about his legacy and nothing else. Our Leos also lost a number of close games this season, Buono knows the team has a lot of talent in the skill positions and likely has nowhere to go but up.

I can see Buono naming someone like McAvoy as Assistant GM for the 2018 season or Mark Washington as Assistant Head Coach. We will get all kinds of language of Wally 'mentoring' potential successors.

Buono does not give up control easily, to make a huge understatement. We saw how that worked with Benevedes and Tedford. I believe Buono will go out in complete control of the Lions. Control freaks just don't stop becoming control freaks.

His consulting contract, following the completion of his Head Coach/GM contract shows Buono wants his influence to continue, once those two roles are gone. He could have walked away when his HC/GM roles were completed.

There will be some who will likely write that Buono will return next season as HC, if he does, because he cares about the B.C. Lions or the team needs him or Braley wants him to return and he wants to do it for Braley but I won't be one of them. If Buono returns, the main reason will be for his own ego is my thought on the subject.

I also didn't buy into the notion that our Leos struggles on the field this season were in large part, due to the potential sale of our Leos and the instability of that situation. The sale of our Leos has been discussed for numerous seasons now and the team could have been sold at any time during those years.

Our Leos played the 2016 season, with the sale of the team hanging in the air and that was not used as an excuse. Of course, we went 11-7 in 2016 so it was not dragged out as a problem.

Our Leos team struggled on the field in almost every area in 2017, from offensive line, Jennings play, defensive line, defensive backfield and special teams. We didn't strengthen the team or address needs in the way we needed to in the off-season prior to this year nor did we address the areas of coaching (eg: scheme, game planning, etc. ) that also needed to be addressed.

This Leos team went 2-9 in its last 11 games. Buono, the GM would have fired any Head Coach with that record. He also would have let go any coordinators whose performances had been this bad.

In fact, after a 2013 season in which we went 11-7, Buono let go Chapdelaine after our offence finished 3rd in CFL passing yards and 4th in points scored. Considering that we had to start DeMarco for a number of games after Lulay hurt his shoulder and missed the last 7 games of that season, it was a successful season on offence. In comparison, with Khari Jones coordinating our offence, our Lions finished 7th in scoring this season.

Buono also got rid of Rich Stubler at the end of 2013. Stubler, in his first season as our defensive coordinator had set many records in coordinating the CFL's best defense that year. In 2013, our defense ranked third in points allowed. Still, Stubler was jettisoned. This season, Mark Washington's defence ranked 7th in the CFL in points allowed.

But the standards that Buono held for Stubler and Chapdelaine will not be the standards that Buono likely holds Mark Washington and Khari Jones to, just as the standards he held Benevedes and Tedford to will not be the standard he holds for himself.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)

DanoT
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Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:09 am

The problem with Wally returning for another season is that with the coaching staff that he has assembled, missing the playoffs for 2018 is a distinct possibility. And if June Jones returns to Hamilton there may not be a western playoff crossover.

Wally could stay on and replace some assistants but a somewhat new batch of assistants might need more than one season to right the ship. So, another reason for Wally to say good bye.

Wally's ego cannot stand another loosing season and while one loosing season in 2017 does not really damage his legacy, a second loosing season (or third?) could. At age 67, Wally needs to retire now and he knows it but is reluctant to admit it.

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Hambone
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Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:36 am

Blitz wrote:
Thu Nov 09, 2017 5:52 am
I can see Buono naming someone like McAvoy as Assistant GM for the 2018 season or Mark Washington as Assistant Head Coach. We will get all kinds of language of Wally 'mentoring' potential successors.
Wouldn't it just be semantics Blitz to give McEvoy the title of Assistant GM? His current title is Director, Football Ops and Player Personnel. If titles meant everything he seems to have a much more impressive position than AGM. :wink: Having said that team bios do tend to fluff up the role of various staff so they can be taken with a grain of salt. McEvoy's bio seems to indicate he does everything one would expect an assistant GM to do.

A native of Surrey, he handles many of the day-to-day activities of the football operations department including player contracts, training camp and scouting preparation.

Neil also plays a key role in the evaluation of new talent for the Canadian Draft alongside Geroy Simon while also working with the club’s director of U.S scouting Ryan Rigmaiden and regional scouts Bob O’Billovich and Bill Diedrick to coordinate the club’s free agent camps in Texas, Washington, D.C., Florida, Georgia, Louisiana, and Washington.
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Hambone
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Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:46 am

DanoT wrote:
Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:09 am
The problem with Wally returning for another season is that with the coaching staff that he has assembled, missing the playoffs for 2018 is a distinct possibility. And if June Jones returns to Hamilton there may not be a western playoff crossover.

Wally could stay on and replace some assistants but a somewhat new batch of assistants might need more than one season to right the ship. So, another reason for Wally to say good bye.

Wally's ego cannot stand another loosing season and while one loosing season in 2017 does not really damage his legacy, a second loosing season (or third?) could. At age 67, Wally needs to retire now and he knows it but is reluctant to admit it.
I'm not saying it's not time for Wally to move on as I do think it's time for new younger blood. What I'm curious about is why names like Hufnagel (66 now) and Jones (65 in Feb) are getting so much cred as possible replacements given they are basically the same vintage as Buono. If Wally does decide to call it a day I certainly hope his positions are replaced by guys who can be long-term solutions. For sure whomever takes the VP or GM jobs should be somebody the organization envisions being here for at least the next decade. One would hope for the same for a HC however it seems to be more the exception than the rule for a HC to last more than 4 or 5 years.
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