Jovan leaves the Den. Confirmation on Page 8.

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WestCoastJoe
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JohnHenry wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:
JohnHenry wrote:I'm not understanding how Mtl could trade Foucault's "rights" to B.C. if he's not under contract?
IMO, JohnHenry ...

There are contracts between clubs and players. And there are agreements between the clubs themselves. It involves free agency as an issue, and it involves a club owning the rights to a player.

https://www.theatlantic.com/entertainme ... ss/241783/

https://www.google.ca/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=6wW ... &*&spf=376

Curt Flood challenged Major League Baseball's "reserve clause," back in 1969, 1970. It led to an agreement whereby players could achieve free agency. Prior to that, a club held a player's rights forever. Flood never played again, but he told his lawyer to go ahead with the suit anyway, as it would benefit other players. :beer:

As we know, the CFL has negotiation lists, giving teams the rights to unsigned players. And CFL teams have the rights to players they draft. These amount to contracts or agreements between teams, before player contracts are signed.

Not fair? Well, the CFL would probably not exist without them. Just as the CFL might not exist without the teams renegotiating some contracts, and without teams having the ability to just walk away from contracts, and release players. It ain't nice and it ain't fair, but it is the reality.

If players want to play in the CFL, that is what they accept.

There are many issues and complexities involved, of course. Top players do more than alright, I would suggest. Jovan has not taken a hit on his contract. He may well have improved it.

Just IMO, just my view of "rights" ...
Thanks for the response WCJ. I guess as a Draft pick the Als could either have released or traded Foucault after not being able to sign him. He apparently wanted starter's money. Hopefully the Lions can sign him and perhaps start Foucault in another position, rather than just backing up LT? It was reported if the Lions sign Foucault they would owe the Als another player, the Neg list player I presume.
You are welcome, JohnHenry.

Like many others, I did not like the sound of this trade, when I first read about it on here. Jovan is as good as it gets with a player. But he is an International. He is relatively expensive, when looking at the cap.

Was Wally in very bad shape re the cap? Did he get enough in return for Jovan?

We hear that Wally wanted Phillippe Gagnon for Jovan. Gagnon is 23, Foucault is 28. Gagnon was drafted #2 overall in 2016. Foucault was #5 overall in 2014. I am inclined to agree with Wally that Gagnon might have been a better asset to acquire. Foucault could be very good also.

We improved our National OL depth. Will Foucault start? Dunno about that. I would expect Hunter Steward is seen as the front runner for left tackle. Foucault would certainly be a very good backup there. Will Foucault start at right tackle? Possibly, especially if we draft a very high level OT type in this year's draft, to build our OL Nat depth even more. More likely, methinks, is that we start 4 Nationals on the OL.

Just IMO ...
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David
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Jovan's reaction to the trade? Shock at first, for sure. Then likely confusion, hurt, maybe even a slight feeling of betrayal - he did everything right, after all. Isn't that how a pro is supposed to comport himself? It's probably more like resignation now, much like the rest of us.

Anyway, good follow-up article from Postmedia's Mike Beamish HERE.

“I was shocked, like everybody,” Olafioye says. “I’ve always been a good pro. I never cause anybody any problems. I’m very respectful. I went to work every day and did what I had to do. Me, I don’t understand it.

“I don’t see how you can trade a franchise left tackle, one of the league’s most consistent players for seven seasons, who never missed a game. I really don’t understand Wally’s decision. But I still have a lot of respect for the man.”



DH :cool:
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Blitz
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David wrote:Jovan's reaction to the trade? Shock at first, for sure. Then likely confusion, hurt, maybe even a slight feeling of betrayal - he did everything right, after all. Isn't that how a pro is supposed to comport himself? It's probably more like resignation now, much like the rest of us.

Anyway, good follow-up article from Postmedia's Mike Beamish HERE.

“I was shocked, like everybody,” Olafioye says. “I’ve always been a good pro. I never cause anybody any problems. I’m very respectful. I went to work every day and did what I had to do. Me, I don’t understand it.

“I don’t see how you can trade a franchise left tackle, one of the league’s most consistent players for seven seasons, who never missed a game. I really don’t understand Wally’s decision. But I still have a lot of respect for the man.”


DH :cool:
I think the trade of Olifioye was a shock to almost everyone...fans, teammates, football reporters as well as to Jovan himself.

I don't think it was part of Wally's plan to trade Olifioye for 2017. Rainey had to be given a big raise and Wally also had to sign Sol E. Burnham left and Wally signed Chris Williams. Wally had to get into a bidding war for Waters with Hamilton, which turned out to be more costly for a kicker than anticipated. Then Burnham became available again and had to be signed. Wally was now up against the cap and had to reduce salary. He wasn't going to get it from Sol E, who has just been signed again. Olifioye had a big contract and therefore he became the go to guy in terms of Wally wanting to take a pay cut.

Hunter Steward also had an injury free season last year, had showed his toughness and ability at left guard, and is a natural tackle. Wally knew he could move Steward out to left tackle and that would also allow him to line up Manny, Burnham, and Williams at receiver but with Gore's pending retirement, Wally's likely thinking was also that he would either have to start Iannuzzi or go with a fourth International receiver.

Wally obviously felt that Iannuzzi was not good enough for that role so therefore there was even more impetus to go with four Internationals on the offensive line.

But Wally could have done that and moved Olifioye back to right tackle. That move would have worked well from a talent perspective but not a cap perspective. Antionio Johnson or a new International signing to play right tackle was a lot cheaper.

Olifioye would not take a salary cut overall. Therefore the decision was to trade him.

The concept that Wally needed a backup National tackle doesn't seem to hold true in that Wally tried to get Gagnon out of Montreal first and he is a guard. That would have meant that either Fabian or Vailencourt would be in the role of a backup, should we have traded for Gagnon.

Wally needed four Nationals to start and he had four who could start in Steward, Fabian, Vaillencourt, and Husband. But if he did that he needed quality National backups. What Wally would have done, if Steward got hurt at left tackle this season, had we traded for Gagnon is nebulous - he likely would have drafted a National offensive tackle this year has to be the assumption.

It would have made more sense for Wally want to trade for Facault, a left tackle, as either a starting left tackle or a backup left tackle in the first place.

Perhaps, now, by trading for Facault, Wally may either start Steward or Fagault at left tackle. If Wally gives the nod to Facult, then Steward will likely remain at left guard. Wally may also want to play Facault at guard in his first season. Should he want to do that, then either Fabian goes to backup or Vaillencourt doesn't move into a starter role this season.

Of course Wally could also start Facult at right tackle. Wally will likely draft an offensive lineman with one of our two first round draft choices. If Wally goes with four Nationals on the line, he would have two National backup offensive linemen - one of Steward, Facault, Husband, Fabian and Vaillencourt plus Dhillon plus Horton and Pennell, who were signed for this season (plus a potential draft choice).

Horton is a converted defensive lineman out of SFU and Pennell is an offensive lineman who started 50 games for UBC and was a second Second-Team All-Canadian selection in 2013 as well as a Canada West All-Star and he helped lead the Thunderbirds to a national championship win in 2015.

But if Wally decided to start five Nationals on the offensive line, he would only have Dhillon plus Horton and Pennell plus a potential first round 2017 offensive lineman and that potential offensive lineman would need to be able to be a backup offensive tackle.

I dont' see Wally doing that. Wally appears to want to copy the Stamps model of having a backup for every offensive line position. The Stampeders offensive line success over many seasons is based on a number of factors: 1) coaching (eg: Delmonaco) 2) drafting a lot of offensive lineman 3) being able to replace injured offensive linemen without missing a beat.

That means that Wally, by wanting a backup at every line position, will want to start an International at one line position with an International backup. He wants a backup National at each position and a backup offensive tackle at each position, as well as someone who could step in and play center if necessary.

Wally is thinking that the Stamps offensive line success has been based upon competition. That is not something we have had much of here in B.C. on our offensive line over recent years. If we go in that direction, it will mean having more National offensive linemen on our practice roster.

Injuries forced the Stamps last season to use many different hoggies — 12 different offensive linemen saw duty in the trenches in 2016 and not once after the 11th game of the season did Calgary start the same five starters in back-to-back games. Yet they run blocked well enough for Messam to win the rushing title and they protected Bo Levi Mitchell much better than any other team did for their quarterback.

The Stamps go into the 2017 season with Nationals Dan Federkeil, Pierre Lavertu, CFL All Star Wilson, Shane Bergman, Cam Thorn, Brad Erdos and Randy Richards who all made starts in 2016 as well as young linemen Roman Grozman, and Karl Lavoie.

That means that he will want to start an International with a backup. He wants a backup National at each position and a backup offensive tackle at each position, as well as someone who could step in and play center if necessary.

Our National offensive lineman right now are:

Hunter Steward
Kirby Fabian
Cody Husband
James David Facautl
Jas Dhillon
Quinn Horton
Alex Pennell
Potential draft choice

International

Antonio Johnson
Vincent Brown
Nate Isles

In terms of the 2017 draft Mason Woods, Geoff Grey, Dariusz Bladek, Qadr Spooner, and Jean-Simon Roy are all potential first round offensive line selections. Jeremy Zver would also be an option in the first two rounds and he is an offensive left tackle.

If we take an offensive lineman in the first round, we would have five first round offensive linemen on our team (Fabian, Steward, Facault, Vaillencourt, plus the new selection. A key to the success of the Stamps has been their focus on the offensive line in the draft...they have used 10 selections over the past four seasons to choose offensive linemen and they used their first round selection for an offensive lineman in 2013, 2014, and 2015.

They have also selected very well. For example in the second round of the 2013 cfl draft we drafted Haidara when Brett Jones was available and we needed a center.

We have an exciting group of recievers for 2017 along with Johnson and Rainey. But the key to it all is Jonathan Jennings.

Jennings is only 24 years old. Anthony Calvillo was 31 when he won his first MOP award. Henry Burris was 35. Damon Allen wAS 42, Kerry Joseph was 34 and ) and Khari Jones was 30. Jonathan Jennings should only get better but we also have to protect him. Quarterback injuries have taken their toll on recent quarterbacks as Ricky Ray and Zack Collaras. Many other quarterbacks have missed time during a football season in recent years due to injury.

The key is not having a backup quarterback. The key is keeping your starting quarterback healthy.
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The Montreal Als have signed Jordan Olifioye to a three year contract extension that locks Jovan up until the end of the 2019 season. Smart move on behalf of the Als, who won't have to deal with Jovan becoming a free agent until the end of the 2019 season.
MONTREAL — The Montreal Alouettes have signed recently-acquired offensive tackle Jovan Olafioye to a three-year contract extension, the team announced Tuesday.

Olafioye, an international tackle and six-time CFL All-Star, was acquired by the Alouettes last week in a trade with the BC Lions.
The deal keeps Olafioye in Montreal through the 2019 season.

“We are extremely happy about the turn of events and that we were able to agree on a three-year term with a player that will play an important role in our offence this upcoming season as well as the ones to follow,” declared Alouettes General Manager, Kavis Reed.

Olafioye (6’6″, 325 lbs.), 29, was named a CFL All-Star the past six seasons. The seven-year veteran was voted the CFL’s Most Outstanding Offensive Lineman in 2012, while also being selected the West Division’s Most Outstanding Lineman on three separate occasions (2011, 2012 and 2015). Since the beginning of his CFL-career, he has made 126 consecutive starts.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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Blitz wrote:The Montreal Als have signed Jordan Olifioye to a three year contract extension that locks Jovan up until the end of the 2019 season. Smart move on behalf of the Als, who won't have to deal with Jovan becoming a free agent until the end of the 2019 season.
MONTREAL — The Montreal Alouettes have signed recently-acquired offensive tackle Jovan Olafioye to a three-year contract extension, the team announced Tuesday.

Olafioye, an international tackle and six-time CFL All-Star, was acquired by the Alouettes last week in a trade with the BC Lions.
The deal keeps Olafioye in Montreal through the 2019 season.

“We are extremely happy about the turn of events and that we were able to agree on a three-year term with a player that will play an important role in our offence this upcoming season as well as the ones to follow,” declared Alouettes General Manager, Kavis Reed.

Olafioye (6’6″, 325 lbs.), 29, was named a CFL All-Star the past six seasons. The seven-year veteran was voted the CFL’s Most Outstanding Offensive Lineman in 2012, while also being selected the West Division’s Most Outstanding Lineman on three separate occasions (2011, 2012 and 2015). Since the beginning of his CFL-career, he has made 126 consecutive starts.
Apparently the base salary of this new contract has been reported to be about $165-175,000. Thats a pretty good deal if you ask me. Apparently when Wally asked Jovan to take a paycut, he said he would only if he signed an extension. Considering this extension only goes for one extra year after his original contract would have ended, its amazing Wally wouldn't have agreed to that. I would say that is less than market value for Jovan, considering Dennis got about $170,000 from Saskatchewan, and I think Stanley Bryant is in that neighborhood too.
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I think it has been previously reported that Olafioye was making $200k with the Lions. So now he renegotiates a contract with the Als for less $ and one extra year. Bit of a :dizzy:

For me, this reinforces the thought that in spite of media reported SMS problems, the Olafioye/Foucalt trade was less about Wally being unable to renegotiate with Olafioye and more about needing to move him in order to get NAT OT depth.
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DanoT wrote:I think it has been previously reported that Olafioye was making $200k with the Lions. So now he renegotiates a contract with the Als for less $ and one extra year. Bit of a :dizzy:

For me, this reinforces the thought that in spite of media reported SMS problems, the Olafioye/Foucalt trade was less about Wally being unable to renegotiate with Olafioye and more about needing to move him in order to get NAT OT depth.
We'll probably never know for sure because Wally (and I'm putting this kindly) can be very cagey as well as skillful in spinning things to his advantage.

However, my thought is that if Wally had preferred to get National offensive line depth by trading Olifioye, he would have done it before free agency, when teams had more dollars to spend on an International high priced star offensive lineman. Wally also had a lof of months to decide whether he wanted to go with four Internationals or not. Wally also wanted Gagnon out of Montreal, who is a guard so he was not looking to trade for a backup National tackle for Steward. There had to be some cap pressure involved due to the late date as well as impetus to play four Nationals. But then again, perhaps not. Instead maybe Wally had a change of mind, in terms of how he wanted to approach this season.

Certainly, Wallys' approach to the media focuses on the fact that Oliifioye was highly paid. If Wally had said he just wanted to trade Olifioye because he wanted more National depth, the trade may have been questioned more. Maybe optics played a role in how it was presented. Don't forget Wally signed McCallum to a new contract and then waited until the early days of training camp and then tried to get him to quietly retire, with other CFL teams already having made decisions on their kicker for that season.

As for Olifioye, he also got signing bonuses as well as his salary so the $175,000 is only part of his contract.
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I have been out of the loop on CFL news for a few days now but has Foucault actually put pen to paper and signed with the Lions?
TheLionKing
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CardiacKid wrote:I have been out of the loop on CFL news for a few days now but has Foucault actually put pen to paper and signed with the Lions?
No announcement yet.
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Gridiron Ernie
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This on the Lions' website this morning -- Foucault signed through till 2019. http://www.bclions.com/2017/04/11/lions ... ault-2019/
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WestCoastJoe
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Gridiron Ernie wrote:This on the Lions' website this morning -- Foucault signed through till 2019. http://www.bclions.com/2017/04/11/lions ... ault-2019/
:thup:

Good news.

Acquiring a high level NAT talent in exchange for an INT definitely helps the roster ratio. No one wants to give up a player like Jovan, but one can see why this was done.

INTs provide a much, much deeper pool of talent from which to recruit (easier to acquire, easier to build the roster). NATs are drafted. They can then only be acquired through trade or free agency.

This trade might provide Wally some cap room. More importantly, it adds a very high level NAT talent, with some experience, to the roster.

NATs are not necessarily cheaper than INTs.
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The CFL mock draft version 2 is showing the Lions with their 2 picks going with Bladek and Senior, both offensive linemen. Marshall Ferguson acknowledges the trade of Olafioye for Foucault and Brown in the article but I guess still feels the Leos would be wise to select 2 more Nationals for the O-line.

Conjecture of course. I wonder if the acquisition of Foucault's name on paper may have Wally thinking a little bit outside the box when it comes to potential picks in the draft. Maybe tight-end Auclair instead of Bladek and Senior?
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DanoT
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Having Steward and Foucalt on the roster and capable of playing both OT and OG gives BC great flexibility but if a rash of injuries strike the Oline (see Riders and Stamps last season), BC doesn't really have enough NAT depth at OT. Drafting a OT in the first round who is maybe a year or so away from starting would be smart long term planning, imo.

What if BC can't re-sign Steward this season and he is lost to free agency next year? Better draft an OT to back up Foucalt who is under contract until 2019.
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DanoT wrote:Having Steward and Foucalt on the roster and capable of playing both OT and OG gives BC great flexibility but if a rash of injuries strike the Oline (see Riders and Stamps last season), BC doesn't really have enough NAT depth at OT. Drafting a OT in the first round who is maybe a year or so away from starting would be smart long term planning, imo.

What if BC can't re-sign Steward this season and he is lost to free agency next year? Better draft an OT to back up Foucalt who is under contract until 2019.
I completely agree that we should draft a National tackle. A National tackle can also be transitioned and developed inside to play the guard position but the inverse doesn't happen...very, very difficult to take a National guard and convert him into a tackle...at least a left tackle.

I was very surprised that Wally went after Gagnon first in the trade with Montreal. If he was moving Steward to left tackle, we would not have had a backup National tackle for Steward, had that trade gone through, nor was there a guarantee we would be able to draft a National left tackle in this 2017 draft.

We really should have locked up Steward for more than one season. A National who can be a starter at left tackle is gold.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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Wally has said that he only wants to start two Internationals on defense this season (as in the past). He has also said that he would like to start a National at field corner. If that scenario happens this season, Kenyan Parker will start at field corner. Buono signed free agent Matt Bucknor to bolster National talent at field corner.

Should we start a National field corner, that would mean we only need to have one other National on the field on defense. The big question would be what other position would we utilize for that National.

If we go with Edem at safety, we don't need to be starting a National on the defensive line. Instead we could use a second International tackle. But we could also go with an International safety instead and have a National starter on the defensive line at all times. That could be rotating National, such as Forde, Menard, Ainsworth, a National defensive lineman chosen in this year's draft.

But my guess, even though his play last year was anything but stellar, we will go with Edem again at free safety. Calgary uses an International at safey (Bell) whereas the Bombers use a National at the position now (Loffler). It would be interesting to look at the other CFL teams and see who is using an International at the position and which teams are using a National free safety.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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