By some accounts the crowd in attendence last night was the worst since 2002. Since Adam Rita was in charge. Since the X-Files went off the air. Since the Canadian $ was worth an all-time low of .6197. Since American Idol first premiered.
CFL Commissioner Orridge was in attendence last night and got to witness for himself from field level just how bad things have gotten with empty seats. He must be wondering if any of the efforts the league has undertaken with updating the brand, improving its presence on social media and it's overall relevancy to Canadians are just going down the toilet in BC?
Behind that smiling face that I hope he is thinking "how do we get Braley to piss and get off the pot? Do we need to go down another row hoed by David Braley? Do we need to clean up the turds he has left in our path?"
I commend David Braley for all he has done for the Lions and the CFL in the PAST. But he needs to relinquish the reins. Now.
When the Hell is this team going to be sold?!?!
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CardiacKid
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Last edited by CardiacKid on Fri Jul 08, 2016 7:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
i from what i have heard buyer will be some of the waterboys ... which would be similar very successful ownership structure of stampeders in the 2005. Over 10 years the flames bought out all the partners and now own 100%. Advantage of this structure is have lots of incentived owners going around a selling season tickets kinda like Bob Ackles did during that time.
braley's health has been an issue so i assume that is holding up the sale. he's made $20m recent grey cups, but with none likely in next 5 years so that can impact value that much.
braley's health has been an issue so i assume that is holding up the sale. he's made $20m recent grey cups, but with none likely in next 5 years so that can impact value that much.
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TheLionKing
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I don't think David Braley is the problem as much as Dennis Skulsky.
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chwk_lionsfan
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Was there not an article earlier this year/late last year stating that a sale would take place, after the 2016 Grey Cup?
I'm not sure that Braley is the big issue either - but there's certainly some merit to the idea that a group of owners would have incentive to really hit the pavement and figure out ways to make this team more intriguing to the non-hardcore fans.
Which, in a way, is saying that the current management/promotions/sales departments are simply not getting it done, on a number of levels. The first of which, to me, is a way too pricy ticket for the product.
Which, in a way, is saying that the current management/promotions/sales departments are simply not getting it done, on a number of levels. The first of which, to me, is a way too pricy ticket for the product.
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chwk_lionsfan
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I don't necessarily think that they're "not getting it done."
It almost seems like this organization is in a holding pattern until it does sell, unfortunately in Vancouver the best way to get fans back is to put a winning product on the field. You can market and market and market the team, but until the results on the field improve, the attendance won't.
Does anyone know who some of the BC groups are that are interested in buying the team? I heard the name Aquilini tossed around(no thanks).
It almost seems like this organization is in a holding pattern until it does sell, unfortunately in Vancouver the best way to get fans back is to put a winning product on the field. You can market and market and market the team, but until the results on the field improve, the attendance won't.
Does anyone know who some of the BC groups are that are interested in buying the team? I heard the name Aquilini tossed around(no thanks).
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CardiacKid
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Braley is the owner and as such, ultimately responsible for the performance of the team on and off the field. The buck stops with him.
This situation with the Lions attendence continuously dropping is edging dangerously closer and closer to what the Argos dealt with during Braley's ownership. You can argue his role with the Argos was simply to keep the team afloat until a better situation could be "arranged" for the team. But Braley dithered and overpriced the team; therefore keeping suitors at bay and exacerbating the tenuous relationship the Argos had with Toronto. Plus he kept even the most basic of supports from the team in a completely parsimonious and cynical manoeuvre to puff up his profits before ultimately departing the scene.
This holding pattern has got to progress to a sale. And I am becoming increasingly concerned Braley is simply going to wait and wait; holding the health of the BC Lions hostage and forcing the league to step in and sweeten the pot in order to get him to relinquish the team to new owners.
I agree the team will benefit immensely from local ownership and not some form of absentee landlord. The Argos had MLSE on hand as saviour; either for good or bad depending on your view but at least they are a Toronto-based brand working with a Toronto product in their home market.
Let's get this done before the team rots on the vine.
This situation with the Lions attendence continuously dropping is edging dangerously closer and closer to what the Argos dealt with during Braley's ownership. You can argue his role with the Argos was simply to keep the team afloat until a better situation could be "arranged" for the team. But Braley dithered and overpriced the team; therefore keeping suitors at bay and exacerbating the tenuous relationship the Argos had with Toronto. Plus he kept even the most basic of supports from the team in a completely parsimonious and cynical manoeuvre to puff up his profits before ultimately departing the scene.
This holding pattern has got to progress to a sale. And I am becoming increasingly concerned Braley is simply going to wait and wait; holding the health of the BC Lions hostage and forcing the league to step in and sweeten the pot in order to get him to relinquish the team to new owners.
I agree the team will benefit immensely from local ownership and not some form of absentee landlord. The Argos had MLSE on hand as saviour; either for good or bad depending on your view but at least they are a Toronto-based brand working with a Toronto product in their home market.
Let's get this done before the team rots on the vine.
How can you guys say the team isn't marketing itself.....we have brand new home and away uniforms to appeal to millennials! (laugh). 
The club's marketing budget has clearly taken a hit. If you weren't a hard-core fan or season ticket holder and avidly paying attention to tweets from @bclions, you'd never know there was a football game in town Thursday.
DH
The club's marketing budget has clearly taken a hit. If you weren't a hard-core fan or season ticket holder and avidly paying attention to tweets from @bclions, you'd never know there was a football game in town Thursday.
DH
Roar, You Lions, Roar
^^and that's really my point.
It's easy to pinpoint Braley and suggest he's the reason this is faltering. But it's not that simple. The Argos didn't struggle in Toronto simply because Braley was their owner. There are a myriad of reasons why the Argos are in an uphill fight - Braley just happened to be the owner while their struggles became very obvious
We're seeing the same thing here. The Lions are struggling to make an impression. That's not all because they're waiting for a new owner. This is way, way, way beyond Braley's ownership situation
It's easy to pinpoint Braley and suggest he's the reason this is faltering. But it's not that simple. The Argos didn't struggle in Toronto simply because Braley was their owner. There are a myriad of reasons why the Argos are in an uphill fight - Braley just happened to be the owner while their struggles became very obvious
We're seeing the same thing here. The Lions are struggling to make an impression. That's not all because they're waiting for a new owner. This is way, way, way beyond Braley's ownership situation
Two things. I'm not going to push the panic button because attendance was announced under 19K on a Thursday night early in the season. Winning, exciting football can cure some of the ills and should get it back to respectable numbers. I also don't want to speak ill of someone in poor health, especially when David Braley stepped up when no one else would. But it should also be noted that Braley approves the marketing budget for this football club and, dollar for dollar, I think the Whitecaps spend a hell of lot more to market themselves in this city than the Lions.
I think they may have over-estimated the "Buono effect" - that we would magically return to 2011 levels in fan interest because Wally was returning to the sideline. They also dithered on selling Jennings as the face of the franchise. It started out that way until contract demands changed the narrative to, "we'll just get to training camp and see who emerges then."
DH
I think they may have over-estimated the "Buono effect" - that we would magically return to 2011 levels in fan interest because Wally was returning to the sideline. They also dithered on selling Jennings as the face of the franchise. It started out that way until contract demands changed the narrative to, "we'll just get to training camp and see who emerges then."
DH
Roar, You Lions, Roar
I don't know enough about the Lions' marketing plans and budget to make comparisons. I know the club has significantly ramped up social media coverage with more videos, photos and articles on the team's website and on social media, in particular Twitter and Instagram. I know they're also distributing a lot more free and discounted tickets. For the preseason game, thousands of freebies were offered to season ticketholders. For the home opener, the team offered $5 kids tickets and seemed to heavily promote the offer through traditional and social media. For the Argo game, the team distributed hundreds, if not thousands, of tickets to Canadian Armed Forces members and first responders. The next game is being marketed as bobblehead night, which is usually a strong promotion. The team seems to be offering a lot more free and discounted tickets and promotional giveaways this year to get people in the stands.David wrote:Two things. I'm not going to push the panic button because attendance was announced under 19K on a Thursday night early in the season. Winning, exciting football can cure some of the ills and should get it back to respectable numbers. I also don't want to speak ill of someone in poor health, especially when David Braley stepped up when no one else would. But it should also be noted that Braley approves the marketing budget for this football club and, dollar for dollar, I think the Whitecaps spend a hell of lot more to market themselves in this city than the Lions.
I think they may have over-estimated the "Buono effect" - that we would magically return to 2011 levels in fan interest because Wally was returning to the sideline. They also dithered on selling Jennings as the face of the franchise. It started out that way until contract demands changed the narrative to, "we'll just get to training camp and see who emerges then."
DH
Fan support seems to remain strong. Polls continue to show the Lions are a strong second to the Canucks in fan support among the general public in B.C., and TV viewership seems to back that up. I believe Skulsky has said recently that corporate sponsorship has never been stronger, and the Blitz section in The Province has been greatly expanded this year, with strong advertising support.
The problem, as I've maintained for several years, is that more fans are choosing to stay home and watch games on their own HD screens, without dealing with the cost and congestion of public transit, traffic and parking. This is a broader issue for sports teams in general but the Lions may be at the leading edge of the trend because of their unfavourable recent schedule, the fact that their core fan base is outside of the city of Vancouver and the generally high cost of living on the Lower Mainland, which leaves the average sports fan with much less disposable income than their counterparts in most Canadian cities.
The Lions have consistently, under Skulsky's watch, over-estimated every effect. The move to Empire. The new BC Place stadium. What the public was willing to pay. Their new seating structure, concessions, promotions. Jeff Tedford. There really isn't a single facet of the team they've failed to over-estimate. And we, the underwhelmed fans are getting a little tired of it.David wrote:I think they may have over-estimated the "Buono effect"
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TheLionKing
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Didn't I read that Skulsky stated the season ticket sales are up this year ? If so, are the new ticket holders masquerading as empty seats ?
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CardiacKid
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Braley is in the position to effect the biggest change, the most positive change. He is the one to provide the tools to his staff to implement that change. There is, IMO, a reluctance to implement a cohesive, unified and effective marketing plan. If Braley is the hands-off owner has been suggested, at the very least be the catalyst to dictate a change.
Right now his position is seemingly more and more the lame duck owner. He has publicly stated the team is for sale yet no movement seems to have occurred on that front. Skulsky has taken (accepted?) a reduced role with the club but who has filled the void left by that change? There is no fine line between being a caretaker or neglectful; towards the end of his Argo ownership, Braley was entirely neglectful and even morphed into an obstacle to the continued existence of the Argos.
My original post was not to suggest he was part of the cause negatively impacting the Lion's or Argo's attendance. But that enthusiasm Braley once had for being a CFL owner seemed to have evaporated. If the Leo's were at the top of their game and had some idea of how they wanted to cultivate and maintain a fan base; then having a hands-off owner could actually be desirable.
Right now his position is seemingly more and more the lame duck owner. He has publicly stated the team is for sale yet no movement seems to have occurred on that front. Skulsky has taken (accepted?) a reduced role with the club but who has filled the void left by that change? There is no fine line between being a caretaker or neglectful; towards the end of his Argo ownership, Braley was entirely neglectful and even morphed into an obstacle to the continued existence of the Argos.
My original post was not to suggest he was part of the cause negatively impacting the Lion's or Argo's attendance. But that enthusiasm Braley once had for being a CFL owner seemed to have evaporated. If the Leo's were at the top of their game and had some idea of how they wanted to cultivate and maintain a fan base; then having a hands-off owner could actually be desirable.
at least 1/3 of the season ticket holders didn't show up for thursday night game, just watched it on TV ... stop scheduling thursday night games or they will do it permanently .. its too hard to fight traffic now.TheLionKing wrote:Didn't I read that Skulsky stated the season ticket sales are up this year ? If so, are the new ticket holders masquerading as empty seats ?