Cuts announced.

The Place for BC Lion Discussion. A forum for Lions fans to talk and chat about our team.
Discussion, News, Information and Speculation regarding the BC Lions and the CFL.
Prowl, Growl and Roar!

Moderator: Team Captains

User avatar
DanoT
Hall of Famer
Posts: 4309
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 6:38 pm
Location: Victoria, B.C. in summer, Sun Peaks Resort in winter

Unless the Riders did some sort of tampering so that Ese and Guy knew that if they turned down a PR spot with the Lions and then they could get a contract promised from the Riders, then Wally has nothing to be steamed about. Wally couldn't sign these players to a PR spot so he could have cut someone else from the 46man roster or not. He chose not and it was his choice to let the players go.
User avatar
WestCoastJoe
Hall of Famer
Posts: 17721
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 8:55 pm

B.C. Lions: Word from the Left Coast is that the Lions are upset with Saskatchewan for grabbing two Canadians B.C. wanted to put on the practice roster. One source said Wally Buono was so angry that he could’ve thrown the players in the Fraser River and let them float to Regina.-- Justin Dunk
One can hardly expect players to be happy about going on the PR. If they feel they have value, they can say no.

In the case of Guy, who seems to have very high value, why not put him on the injury list? He was Lions' property. He might eventually have moved ahead of O'Neill or Dhillon or possibly even Fabien.

If Wally valued him, find a way to keep him. Did Wally let him slip away unnecessarily? Pockets picked.

Chris Jones does not take prisoners. He leaves behind a scorched earth. He makes few friends. Chris Jones --> football sociopath. LOL

Wheeling and dealing in football ... Don't trust anybody from another team. Get it in writing. Witnessed. Filmed. Notarized. Plan accordingly. Gentlemen's Agreement -- worthless. Verbal contract -- worthless.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
Qman
Champion
Posts: 932
Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 12:59 pm
Location: Section 240

WestCoastJoe wrote:
B.C. Lions: Word from the Left Coast is that the Lions are upset with Saskatchewan for grabbing two Canadians B.C. wanted to put on the practice roster. One source said Wally Buono was so angry that he could’ve thrown the players in the Fraser River and let them float to Regina.-- Justin Dunk
One can hardly expect players to be happy about going on the PR. If they feel they have value, they can say no.

In the case of Guy, who seems to have very high value, why not put him on the injury list? He was Lions' property. He might eventually have moved ahead of O'Neill or Dhillon or possibly even Fabien.

If Wally valued him, find a way to keep him. Did Wally let him slip away unnecessarily? Pockets picked.

Chris Jones does not take prisoners. He leaves behind a scorched earth. He makes few friends. Chris Jones --> football sociopath. LOL

wally said today both players were cut.

i assume they made a organizational decision that their are other cdns on the roster they would rather protect given they are over 20 NATS right now, 3 guys will have to be "hidden"/really injured
Last edited by Qman on Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
WestCoastJoe
Hall of Famer
Posts: 17721
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 8:55 pm

Qman wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:
B.C. Lions: Word from the Left Coast is that the Lions are upset with Saskatchewan for grabbing two Canadians B.C. wanted to put on the practice roster. One source said Wally Buono was so angry that he could’ve thrown the players in the Fraser River and let them float to Regina.-- Justin Dunk
One can hardly expect players to be happy about going on the PR. If they feel they have value, they can say no.

In the case of Guy, who seems to have very high value, why not put him on the injury list? He was Lions' property. He might eventually have moved ahead of O'Neill or Dhillon or possibly even Fabien.

If Wally valued him, find a way to keep him. Did Wally let him slip away unnecessarily? Pockets picked.

Chris Jones does not take prisoners. He leaves behind a scorched earth. He makes few friends. Chris Jones --> football sociopath. LOL

wally said today both players were cut.

i assume they made a organizational decision that their are other cdns on the roster they would rather protect given they are over 20 NATS right now, 3 guys will have to be "hidden"
Cut to the PR, which they refused. This fan thinks we should have "hidden" Dillon Guy. Just a matter of different paperwork. If he is set on not staying with the Lions, trade his rights.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
Qman
Champion
Posts: 932
Joined: Wed May 02, 2012 12:59 pm
Location: Section 240

WestCoastJoe wrote:
Qman wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:

wally said today both players were cut.

i assume they made a organizational decision that their are other cdns on the roster they would rather protect given they are over 20 NATS right now, 3 guys will have to be "hidden"
Cut to the PR, which they refused. This fan thinks we should have "hidden" Dillon Guy. Just a matter of different paperwork.
no, they were offered PR spots, where were rejected, so the team made the decision to release them.
I doubt they have any trade value given its cuttdown day. I guess you could have 6-gamed guy, built him up, then tried to traded him. but there is no trade value for a marginal roster player in CFL. whats the point. Wally didn't like these guys attitudes to he dumped them.

even john murphy said today they were plain outright released so they signed them
Last edited by Qman on Mon Jun 20, 2016 5:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
User avatar
WestCoastJoe
Hall of Famer
Posts: 17721
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 8:55 pm

Qman wrote:
no, they were offered PR spots, where were rejected, so the team made the decision to release them. even john murphy said today they were released so they signed them
Yes, they were released.

Dillon Guy had value as a football asset, and as a player. Hide him.

Just IMO ...

Heading out. Back later. Last word to you.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
User avatar
CardiacKid
Legend
Posts: 1949
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:46 am
Location: Under Christmas Hill, Saanich

WestCoastJoe wrote:
Chris Jones does not take prisoners. He leaves behind a scorched earth. He makes few friends. Chris Jones --> football sociopath. LOL

Wheeling and dealing in football ... Don't trust anybody from another team. Get it in writing. Witnessed. Filmed. Notarized. Plan accordingly. Gentlemen's Agreement -- worthless. Verbal contract -- worthless.
Chris "All 4 Horseman of the Apocalypse" Jones might enjoy the success his sociopathic ways brings him as coach but as GM he will likely need to temper those habits. Otherwise he is fair game and some other GMs just might feel compelled to stick a target on him.

Meanwhile Ed Hervey seemed to take great delight in beating the Riders; basically referring to them as out of shape and physically whipped.

Never would have thought I would be happy to hear anything uttered by an Eskimoes GM.....could have knocked me over with a feather...
User avatar
WestCoastJoe
Hall of Famer
Posts: 17721
Joined: Mon May 22, 2006 8:55 pm

CardiacKid wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:
Chris Jones does not take prisoners. He leaves behind a scorched earth. He makes few friends. Chris Jones --> football sociopath. LOL

Wheeling and dealing in football ... Don't trust anybody from another team. Get it in writing. Witnessed. Filmed. Notarized. Plan accordingly. Gentlemen's Agreement -- worthless. Verbal contract -- worthless.
Chris "All 4 Horseman of the Apocalypse" Jones might enjoy the success his sociopathic ways brings him as coach but as GM he will likely need to temper those habits. Otherwise he is fair game and some other GMs just might feel compelled to stick a target on him.

Meanwhile Ed Hervey seemed to take great delight in beating the Riders; basically referring to them as out of shape and physically whipped.

Never would have thought I would be happy to hear anything uttered by an Eskimoes GM.....could have knocked me over with a feather...
Jones kind of reminds me of a hockey scheiss disturber. Happiest when people are mad at him.

The CFL is more of a fraternity. No need to make enemies. I expect he burned a bridge with Wally. But he makes good copy. And I like the way he coaches.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
TheLionKing
Hall of Famer
Posts: 25103
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:13 pm
Location: Vancouver

What happens to Josiah St. John if he sits out the entire season ? Does he become a free agent or does he still remain the property of the Riders ?
User avatar
Hambone
Hall of Famer
Posts: 8173
Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2004 10:25 pm
Location: Living in PG when not at BC Place, Grey Cup or Mazatlan.

TheLionKing wrote:What happens to Josiah St. John if he sits out the entire season ? Does he become a free agent or does he still remain the property of the Riders ?
Basically stays their property for 2 years. If he were to play CIS ball this year he'd stay Rider property the season he graduates plus 1 more, in other words until 2019.
You're as old as you've ever been and as young as you're ever going to be.
User avatar
B.C.FAN
Team Captain
Posts: 12579
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 10:28 pm

Wally told Mike Beamish that Mrabure and Guy were simply beaten out for roster positions. They were. Mrabure lost out to Maxx Forde for a D-line spot, while Guy lost out to Jas Dhillon for a backup O-line spot.
“It’s not where you start, it’s where you end up,” Buono explained. “Maxx Forde really worked hard. He’s improved tremendously as a football player. He worked hard all last season. He’s gotten rewarded.”

“Do you know who was the highest rated player last year in the 2015 draft (according to analytics)?” Buono said. “Maxx Forde. Maxx Forde proved this year that we should have taken those numbers more seriously. The guy who made the better plays on defence (in training camp) was Maxx Forde. So Maxx Forde could be our first-round pick from last year.”
“We worked with him, we gave him time off,” Buono said of Guy. “In fairness, he sucked it up and was tough. Unfortunately, it (his knee) is going to be an issue for a while. I can understand why there might be some physical limitations.”

The decision came down to offering an active roster spot to Guy or second-year Lion Jas Dhillon, a backup centre and guard, and Buono went with the latter.
I have no problem with the cuts, and no problem with the Riders scooping them up. Players who couldn't make the roster here get a chance to earn a regular paycheque on a team with less Canadian depth.
Forde had a great camp and preseason. Mrabure didn't. I didn't pay close attention to Guy and Dhillon at centre but Dhillon has been listed ahead of Guy on the depth chart since rookie camp. It's great to have depth.

Lions reward players' progress, but watch Riders pick off demoted draft picks
User avatar
CardiacKid
Legend
Posts: 1949
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:46 am
Location: Under Christmas Hill, Saanich

Hambone wrote:
TheLionKing wrote:What happens to Josiah St. John if he sits out the entire season ? Does he become a free agent or does he still remain the property of the Riders ?
Basically stays their property for 2 years. If he were to play CIS ball this year he'd stay Rider property the season he graduates plus 1 more, in other words until 2019.
The latest news on the St. John quagmire has both sides prepared to let other stew in their own juice for the rest of the year. Don't hold your breath on this getting resolved any time soon.
User avatar
CardiacKid
Legend
Posts: 1949
Joined: Sat Jul 14, 2012 9:46 am
Location: Under Christmas Hill, Saanich

Maybe it's just my mistrust of anything issuing forth from the Land of StubbleJumping and Honey but there still is something weird about this business with Guy and EMA. Maybe its my lack of knowledge of the collective agreement with the CFLPA and how the AR, PR and IR can be juggled by the teams and still remain within the letter of the law. Or how teams have to make their moves known to their brethren on the other clubs.

The timing of their signing with the Riders seems awfully "quick"....like scary "quick".

The Riders have 2 spots left on their active roster as per what is listed on their website. Neither of Guy or EMA are mentioned anywhere in their listing. According to Mike Beamish, both EMA and Guy have to be provided those spots for week 1. The curious thing about that situation is the fact the Riders will then only have 2 QBs on their active roster. If any team needs a 3rd QB on the active roster, it is the Riders. Now Guy and EMA seem to be guaranteed an active roster spot with active roster pay....but for how long until the Riders get that 3rd QB? I don't like their chances for staying on the active roster, simply because they haven't played or practiced with the Riders.

The Riders deliberately left room on their roster to pick up other teams' cuts...fair enough. But of the approximately 100 players cut over the weekend, they pick 2 from the Lions to fill their remaining 2 spots? Not say 1 from the Leos and 1 from the Stamps or 1 from the RedBlacks and 1 from the Als? Maybe a bit of trying to undercut a team they feel will be their biggest competitor for a playoff spot?

I might be making a mountain out of a molehill (and if CFL Santa gets me what is on my CFL Christmas wish list..namely Brett Boyko) then I will forget about Guy-Gate. But there is a part of my suspicious nature that thinks this should get more scrutiny.....
User avatar
DanoT
Hall of Famer
Posts: 4309
Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 6:38 pm
Location: Victoria, B.C. in summer, Sun Peaks Resort in winter

CardiacKid wrote:
Hambone wrote:
TheLionKing wrote:What happens to Josiah St. John if he sits out the entire season ? Does he become a free agent or does he still remain the property of the Riders ?
Basically stays their property for 2 years. If he were to play CIS ball this year he'd stay Rider property the season he graduates plus 1 more, in other words until 2019.
The latest news on the St. John quagmire has both sides prepared to let other stew in their own juice for the rest of the year. Don't hold your breath on this getting resolved any time soon.
Now that the Riders have Guy they really have little need and no roster spot for St. John so he and his agent are screwed. If wants to turn pro he now has to do it on Jones' terms, literally. :wink: Yup he is really screwed.

LU, writing for 3 Down Nation is confirming that Wally is not "steamed" at Jones and that Riders did nothing unethical or outside the rules concerning Guy and Ese.

I am "steamed" at Wally though for not finding a way to stash Guy. Ese OTOH was Tedford's pick and so far hasn't earned his pay with the Lions and might not be long term with
the Riders either...or he might advance and become more effective in a Jones coached Defense.
TheLionKing
Hall of Famer
Posts: 25103
Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:13 pm
Location: Vancouver

With the reported problem with his knee, I don't think Guy will be playing for the Riders on a regular basis any time soon.
Post Reply