A Revamped Defensive Line!

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Blitz
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MONTREAL — Perhaps it was the fact he arrived early at the scene of the B.C. Lions’ most troubling defeat last year that had Wally Buono thinking as he did when he discussed his future with the CFL team not in infinite terms for the first time.

As he did following last year’s 50-17 playoff loss to the Montreal Alouettes, Buono is sounding again like someone who thinks he could be asked to leave before the end of his contract after the 2016 season if the Lions overhaul is not having the desired effect.

After dropping hints in The Province earlier this year that he might walk away after this season, Buono said he will honour his contract with owner David Braley but recognizes his lasting power is diminishing in the face of lukewarm results and falling attendance.

“At the end of the year I would make a decision whether to extend or not. If we don’t get better they might want to say, ‘Wally, why don’t you take a little buyout?’” Buono said.

“That’s their right, but that’s not what is driving me. What’s driving me is being 3-5 ain’t no fun. We should be better. A 4-4 record or 5-3, I can handle that maybe, but not this. They might not want me here anymore because this is bull sh-t being 3-5.”

Neither Braley nor president Dennis Skulsky have expressed any public dissatisfaction but the discontent on some social media sites of Buono has grown quicker than that of first-year coach Jeff Tedford.

The general manager says he accepts his share of blame but knows it also can be spread around.

“If (Braley) doesn’t like what I’m doing, fire me, I’m fine with that,” he said. “I take my share of personal aggravation and anger. But my hands are somewhat tied. Whether I make a recommendation on personnel or other things, they’re just recommendations and I have the right to do that but I have to stop. Jeff’s made recommendations and I support them. If I make a suggestion I got to let it go.”

A B.C. loss Thursday would drop the Lions into a third-place tie with 3-6 Winnipeg in the West Division but both teams would be three points behind Montreal in the chase for a possible crossover playoff spot.
I don't believe the question should be whether this is Tedfords team or Buonos team but how much influence Buono should have.

Buono said last year that he needed to step back ...but fining players for dead ball penalites and going over game tape with reporters regarding defensive line play is not stepping back nor is influencing Tedford to play Roh or moving Westerman to defensive end are stepping back.

The reality is that Tedford is in his first season as a HC in the CFL. The last time Tedford was in the CFL, he was an assistant coach under HC Buono in Calgary where Buono was successful. Buono has a rep as a HOF Head Coach and our Leos franchise not only had a lot of early success when Buono came here as HC and Buono was the last HC to win a Grey Cup for B.C.

Of course Tedford is going to defer to Buono as his boss and of course he is going to be powerfully influenced in his first season in the CFL as a HC by Buono, whether it comes to personell, assistant coaches, or schemes.

Does that mean that Buono is making most decisions on the field. Of course not! But is Buono having too much influence. It sure appears that way. The decision regarding Roh is a purrfect example. Buono should not be involved in who plays or not. Too many assistants are part of Buonoès old boys network.

But if this team is going to be successful, Tedford needs to find a way to have Wallys have less reins in his hands.. I highly doubt that would be easy or even possible.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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Toppy Vann
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Wow... I have never heard those kind of words from Wally Buono in the Blitz post. Amazing.

I do agree that the old boys network as well as the religious theme right down to their strengths coach is something that seems always around with this organization.

While some of these guys here like Blitz, WCJ, MLF, BC Fan, TLK etc are great X and O guys - I don't buy that Wally is the problem here with the team on the field. He could be faulted for a less than rigorous hiring process of HCs to replace him as they didn't interview widely nor hear from other voices in the interview room what others in the CFL REALLY think of the way the Lions play and their character!

But this is new territory for Wally as he's always been in charge of football except for his dying days with the former Stamps ownership regime where he was being pushed around.

Wally's at fault for the old boys coaching network yes... but make no mistake - THIS IS JEFF TEDFORD'S TEAM and there is nothing stopping him as to how he coaches the coaches and how he instills his philosophy here.

There is a problem in the HC position for reasons I don't know.

In football and team sport the GMs let the HC coach and they don't interfere as in a team there can only be one lead, strong clear voice.

In business at senior corp. levels the boss can intervene and impose his views and directions. In sport if it is not working the HC is fired.

The GM has a limited role in coaching the HC but Wally needs to realize that JT is not instilling a strong performance oriented culture in the team nor clear direction in the key coordinators. This is where Wally needs to be focused. Coaching this HC but this is not wally's strength as he failed with Mike Benevides his buddy.

Mark Washington's comments show me he too is out of his depth and didn't see what Dave Ritchie and Stubler brought to their roles - overall big picture philosophy. Stubler was fired by Kavis Reed for not being more of an individual teacher. While he'd love Mark W. - great individual focus on teaching but a lousy individualistic view of how a team plays together.

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/foot ... story.html

It's not just mano a mano in one on ones as MW seems to coach to but collectively how a group of individuals forms as a team. Yet a team together is only as good as its weakest link but the best teams know how to work and win.
"Ability without character will lose." - Marv Levy
TheLionKing
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“Run defence is an attitude,” defensive coordinator Mark Washington said Tuesday after the Lions practised in Surrey. “You’ve got to want to get after the guys in front of you. You’ve got to want to be physical and get after it and be playing on their side of the line of scrimmage.”

You got to be kidding. You can have all the positive attitude in the world but if the guy across from you is 300+ lbs and you're 285 lbs. you're going to be pushed around.
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cromartie
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I think the answer is somewhat in the middle.

Tedford made the call on Cortez and the offensive line coach. McMann and Washington were kept at the behest or tacit influence of Wally, which was a mistake on both counts.

The defensive line call, now that I think about it, was probably not Wally. I do see some zone blitzing, which tells me that it's probably Washington who thinks that he can use a smaller front four to zone blitz on passing downs while dropping guys back into coverage.
He could be faulted for a less than rigorous hiring process of HCs to replace him
I'm going to take issue with this. There hasn't been a non player head coach in the CFL who had as well rounded an education as MB got in his time with Wally. He handled Special Teams, position coaching, the draft and Defensive Coordinator positions before being promoted to Head Coach. The fact that he crapped the bed in the position doesn't mean Wally didn't do everything he could to prepare MB for him. The saying about leading a horse to water is quite apt in this case.
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Toppy Vann
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cromartie wrote:I think the answer is somewhat in the middle.

Tedford made the call on Cortez and the offensive line coach. McMann and Washington were kept at the behest or tacit influence of Wally, which was a mistake on both counts.

The defensive line call, now that I think about it, was probably not Wally. I do see some zone blitzing, which tells me that it's probably Washington who thinks that he can use a smaller front four to zone blitz on passing downs while dropping guys back into coverage.
He could be faulted for a less than rigorous hiring process of HCs to replace him
I'm going to take issue with this. There hasn't been a non player head coach in the CFL who had as well rounded an education as MB got in his time with Wally. He handled Special Teams, position coaching, the draft and Defensive Coordinator positions before being promoted to Head Coach. The fact that he crapped the bed in the position doesn't mean Wally didn't do everything he could to prepare MB for him. The saying about leading a horse to water is quite apt in this case.
There was NO rigour. Rigour in a hiring process means you interview a good group of potential coaches - inside and outside the organization.

You do this not to just identify the best person for the job but to learn what others believe is the path forward for your team.

When an opponent OC and DC comes to the interview you grill them for their views and you ask for their candid assessments of what they think your team excels and fails at.

You listen for the vision and the understanding of the role that the person brings if not a current HC.

Who will they hire as assistants and why? Who would they not want to keep and why?

What do benevides, stubler, kavis reed, ritchie hall have in common? They were fine in their prior roles but those roles and how they are done are not what give them success as HC. Even Chris Jones is showing some lack in all but def. game decisions. Gambles aren't done well yet.

From what I saw of Mike B from how he acted prior to HC and how when he got the job he wanted to be DC is how I assessed his lack of preparation to be HC.
"Ability without character will lose." - Marv Levy
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DanoT
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In spite of the shock of seeing Brown, Logan, Taylor cut in the off season, the biggest head scratcher for me is seeing both Westerman and Loh playing out of position. So I have wondered all season what football mind is behind this bone head move?

Blitz seems to thing Wally is behind the D line misalignment, Cromartie says he is not so sure. My question is: Do we really know which coach (HC, DC, Dline C) or is it the GM that is behind this strange move?

There has been some questionable and surprising and inept decisions by the Lions with personnel and schemes this season, but the D line misalignment with 2 players playing out of position when there should be none, takes the cake. :bang:
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WestCoastJoe
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TheLionKing wrote:
“Run defence is an attitude,” defensive coordinator Mark Washington said Tuesday after the Lions practised in Surrey. “You’ve got to want to get after the guys in front of you. You’ve got to want to be physical and get after it and be playing on their side of the line of scrimmage.”

You got to be kidding. You can have all the positive attitude in the world but if the guy across from you is 300+ lbs and you're 285 lbs. you're going to be pushed around.
"Run defence is an attitude," says Mark Washington.

True, in part. And our run defence has been terrible. And that was with Bighill and Elimimian at LB, two very good LBs. So MW is putting it on execution. What a surprise. How about the fact that oftentimes Bighill was 25-30 yards back in zone pass coverage? How about the fact that we had only 5 guys in the box at times? How about the system that does not feature blitzing, nor overloads at the LOS, nor feints? How about the system that goes all in to stop long plays by backing off deeper and deeper?

And how about the decision to go with guys inside who are undersized to stop the giant OL from pushing them around?

Nah. According to MW the guys just need the attitude in order to stop the run. The guys just need to execute the outstanding system that they are in.

Pass rush? Another story. And not a happy one either. But, according to Wally, taking the extremely unusual step to break down film with the media, the D Line is doing fine getting pressure on the QB. A head shaker, subject to interpretation, as are all events.

Just IMO ...
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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David
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Looks like we've lost out on another FA. Shawn Lemon signs with RedBlacks.

Great. We get to play him in his first game back too!

At this rate, Khreem Smith is going to become the Gordie Howe of football.

:sigh:


DH :cool:
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Qman
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FYI: Lemon doesn't sign with lions


Roar Report ‏@RoarReport

Lemon going to Redblacks.
Although its a need .. kinda hoped we lose out & wally used cap space for someone better (ie. Jones) #bclions #cfl
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B.C.FAN
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Ottawa just lost their sack leader, defensive end Aston Whiteside, for the season with a knee injury so the signing of Lemon was a no-brainer.
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Sir Purrcival
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DanoT wrote:In spite of the shock of seeing Brown, Logan, Taylor cut in the off season, the biggest head scratcher for me is seeing both Westerman and Loh playing out of position. So I have wondered all season what football mind is behind this bone head move?

Blitz seems to thing Wally is behind the D line misalignment, Cromartie says he is not so sure. My question is: Do we really know which coach (HC, DC, Dline C) or is it the GM that is behind this strange move?

There has been some questionable and surprising and inept decisions by the Lions with personnel and schemes this season, but the D line misalignment with 2 players playing out of position when there should be none, takes the cake. :bang:
And your question is really also an answer. The simple fact that most on this board are not really sure who is doing what to whom should be all the answer we really need to the question. That we cannot say with any certitude that Tedford is making all the coaching decisions is a problem period. This board is populated by a knowledgeable fan base so if we aren't sure, then nobody is. And that certainly is a problem.
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Sir Purrcival
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WestCoastJoe wrote:
TheLionKing wrote:
“Run defence is an attitude,” defensive coordinator Mark Washington said Tuesday after the Lions practised in Surrey. “You’ve got to want to get after the guys in front of you. You’ve got to want to be physical and get after it and be playing on their side of the line of scrimmage.”

You got to be kidding. You can have all the positive attitude in the world but if the guy across from you is 300+ lbs and you're 285 lbs. you're going to be pushed around.
"Run defence is an attitude," says Mark Washington.

True, in part. And our run defence has been terrible. And that was with Bighill and Elimimian at LB, two very good LBs. So MW is putting it on execution. What a surprise. How about the fact that oftentimes Bighill was 25-30 yards back in zone pass coverage? How about the fact that we had only 5 guys in the box at times? How about the system that does not feature blitzing, nor overloads at the LOS, nor feints? How about the system that goes all in to stop long plays by backing off deeper and deeper?

And how about the decision to go with guys inside who are undersized to stop the giant OL from pushing them around?

Nah. According to MW the guys just need the attitude in order to stop the run. The guys just need to execute the outstanding system that they are in.

Pass rush? Another story. And not a happy one either. But, according to Wally, taking the extremely unusual step to break down film with the media, the D Line is doing fine getting pressure on the QB. A head shaker, subject to interpretation, as are all events.

Just IMO ...
In some ways the MW DC is reminiscent for me of MW the player. Now I always thought he was a decent defensive player but I never ever thought of him as a game breaker or standout as a player nor did he ever strike one as an outstanding mental student of the game. As I recall, he was only usually noticeable as the guy who would get the award for community work, not recognition for his outstanding defensive skills. I know that great players sometimes make lousy coaches and that great coaches were often only so-so players but in this case, he appears to be mediocre as a coach which is also how I would characterize him as a player. Good but not great.
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InUrFace
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Once again I believe Wally was to cheap to pick up a good player being cut in the NFL. Lemons gone to RedBlacks. Wally is done Im for one sick of his cheap ways and not finding talent that we need and not getting it when they are available. Then we have a DC who says its not about the stunts formation or schemes Its about the execution and the players arent executing. Wow
thats what Wallys words are all the time back in the day and still to this day. Arent you fans tired as I am of this organization that continues this season after season. I for one am sick of Wally being apart of this organization. Always messing with coaching and saying whats best for the team. Well you getting fired or stepping down would be the best for this team. Period. If they lose tomorrow ..watch them use the same excuses ... we didnt execute we werent good enough. No its what you came up with for the game scheme and play book wise ...wasnt good enough. Hope Im wrong but I believe we will see a beat down in Mont by Mont.
Blitz
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DanoT wrote:In spite of the shock of seeing Brown, Logan, Taylor cut in the off season, the biggest head scratcher for me is seeing both Westerman and Loh playing out of position. So I have wondered all season what football mind is behind this bone head move?

Blitz seems to thing Wally is behind the D line misalignment, Cromartie says he is not so sure. My question is: Do we really know which coach (HC, DC, Dline C) or is it the GM that is behind this strange move?

There has been some questionable and surprising and inept decisions by the Lions with personnel and schemes this season, but the D line misalignment with 2 players playing out of position when there should be none, takes the cake. :bang:
It was Wally who made the public statement that Westerman would be moved outside and Buono was the one who pushed for Roh to be used inside.

Does that mean they were entirely Wally decisions...no...but when Wally announces where our Leos personell will play and where, rather than a HC, you at least create a sense that the HC is not in charge.
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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Toppy Vann
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[
quote]
Just IMO ...
In some ways the MW DC is reminiscent for me of MW the player. Now I always thought he was a decent defensive player but I never ever thought of him as a game breaker or standout as a player nor did he ever strike one as an outstanding mental student of the game. As I recall, he was only usually noticeable as the guy who would get the award for community work, not recognition for his outstanding defensive skills. I know that great players sometimes make lousy coaches and that great coaches were often only so-so players but in this case, he appears to be mediocre as a coach which is also how I would characterize him as a player. Good but not great.
[/quote][/quote][/quote]

I believe you can't be a good to great coach until you stop thinking like a player and think like a coach. You're a manager and leader as well as a teacher. This applied to me. I used to coach kids soccer from a player's perspective as I was coaching kids while still a top player. It wasn't until I had kids and got back into coaching and starting going to Tony Waiters coached practices with the Whitecaps and their clinics and totally grasped for the first time that it was not just teaching and modelling individual skills and techniques but instilling the right performance orientation and expectations and focus purely on basics which for soccer like is hockey is passing and ball or puck control. Then working with senior men and pro athletes it's really critical that you stop thinking like a player.

Some never make the transition.
"Ability without character will lose." - Marv Levy
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