Als 23 @ Leos 13 - Post Game Stats and Comments

[maxlion]

As Joe has long said, look at what the Wally led Lions are up against in the CFL today...Hufnagel, Dickenson and Stubler in CGY, Chris Jones in EDM, Kent Austin in HAM, Scott Milanovich in TOR, a very smart Jim Popp in MTL who won't tolerate losing and even Rick Campbell in OTT. There are few "gimme" wins in the CFL anymore, you have to be your best week in and week out to get wins and we simply are not...and we are NOT even close to these other organizations when it comes to coaching and it shows.

It was not apparent that Austin's teams would make the grey cup game early on in either year. The Ticats were terrible and barely made the playoffs.

Milanovich missed the playoffs last year with the top QB in the league in a historically weak east division--beat out by Bene and Glenn.

Mtl is in a shambles, probably worse off than us.

Jones and Hufnagel are doing great. Let's see if they can keep it up for as long as Wally did in BC and Cal.

[Toppy Vann]

As Joe has long said, look at what the Wally led Lions are up against in the CFL today...Hufnagel, Dickenson and Stubler in CGY, Chris Jones in EDM, Kent Austin in HAM, Scott Milanovich in TOR, a very smart Jim Popp in MTL who won't tolerate losing and even Rick Campbell in OTT. There are few "gimme" wins in the CFL anymore, you have to be your best week in and week out to get wins and we simply are not...and we are NOT even close to these other organizations when it comes to coaching and it shows.

It was not apparent that Austin's teams would make the grey cup game early on in either year. The Ticats were terrible and barely made the playoffs.

Milanovich missed the playoffs last year with the top QB in the league in a historically weak east division--beat out by Bene and Glenn.

Mtl is in a shambles, probably worse off than us.

Jones and Hufnagel are doing great. Let's see if they can keep it up for as long as Wally did in BC and Cal.

You've got a good point on how the Ticats got to the Grey Cup but the trend was up. It isn't that way in BC right now. Als D is pretty good. Down to their 6 or 7 rated QB coming into TC.

Sam's situation was divisive in a team that is regarded as tight and together due to:
> he came out of shape and not ready for football yet was kept.
> his contract put him on the 46 man roster even if he didn't deserve it.
> He left but was allowed to come back - now that is weird when a guy isn't doing the job.
> he was (not his fault) getting media attention while others weren't and they were doing their jobs.

Adding a RB and sitting Bowman is maybe the worst there.

Some focus on play calling in the media was likely felt in the team but Ticats Ryan Bomben from the Als says that team is tight.

Austin is clear what he wants. He's got talent in his OC, DC and ST coaches and he lets them coach. I think he ripped Jeff R in the Lions game for showing a fake punt play - Farhan I think said it was something like 'why are you running that here?' even though the Lions were asleep. Austin's players are clear and mouth the same line he's mouthing - playing for the team and each game as a path to the coveted prize - don't get ahead of ourselves as there is adversity coming . It's the same line coming from the DBs after scoring TDs etc and offensive stars.

His US scouting led by Eric Tillman and his Canadian scouting and trades (Bomben) and hugely FA signing. Taking chances on others castoffs Grigsby seems to all work in his fold.

I keep asking myself these questions?
What is the message from Jeff Tedford? What is his clear philosophy and thinking?
What does he demand of his coaches?
Why no adjustments yet 8 games are in the book?
Why on earth did he waste his time teaching Travis to fall?
Why if this is a development/transition year is there no QB development and I'm not sure that John Beck alone is the future.
Why are players out of position in the D line?
Why aren't plays designed for Lulay's strengths?
Why does Tedford think it is bad that Lulay was forced out of the pocket to where he is actually dangerous? JT said that post game - his design is keep him in the pocket where Cortez can make him look ordinary - I guess.

[DanoT]

I would add one more question.

Where is the incremental improvement as the season progresses?

I see no indication that Tedford is "getting" the modern CFL.

Where is there any innovation?

[WestCoastJoe]

The Lions since 2003 are an excellent case study in sports management.

Jeff Tedford gave us hope. Is that hope fading? It seems so. At this time he does not look to be on a level with Hufnagel, Austin or Milanovich. And it is early, but there are some bad signs.

Just IMO ...

In Austin's first year with the Ticats, they started 1-4, which included a 37-0 loss to Sask, before squeeking into the playoffs. Last year, they started 1-7 before again squeeking in. Not saying that all is well here, just that it is still early and other teams have struggles too.

It was not apparent that Austin's teams would make the grey cup game early on in either year. The Ticats were terrible and barely made the playoffs.

Austin's teams grew and finished strong.

Milanovich missed the playoffs last year with the top QB in the league in a historically weak east division--beat out by Bene and Glenn.

Some think Milanovich is a terrific coach, as do I.

Jones and Hufnagel are doing great. Let's see if they can keep it up for as long as Wally did in BC and Cal.

I think everyone acknowleges Wally's record. Hall of Fame. 2012-2015 results sliding.
.........

Is Austin a great coach? IMO, yes.

Is Hufnagel a great coach? IMO, yes.

Milanovich also.

Jones runs a terrific defence IMO. The jury is still out on some other stuff. Playoffs? Titles? Burn out? Offence?

..........

Wally's record has him in the Hall of Fame. Right now? Many questions.

........

Thanks for defending Wally, as he deserves. He has brought us two titles in his time here, now in year 13 of his regime.

He is under a lot of pressure now, from fans and the media. And that won't let up unless we turn things around.

[David]

I would be interested to know what the Lions players think of their new coach. A continual failure to execute the basics and poor discipline tell me he's not gotten through. The top 4 CFL coaches I would identify as Austin, Hufnagel, Milanovich, and Jones.

* Milanovich's players play for him because he's the consummate "player's coach." They're an underdog team that's been handed a raw deal and he has their back.
* Jones' players buy into his arrogance and "the Eskimo way" - which roughly translates to "screw tradition. We're doing things our own way."
* Huff's guys respect his knowledge, but I get the sense they do well because they're more talented and have very good assistant coaches.
* Austin's guys are probably afraid of him because he's bat-sh*t crazy! LOL. They play with an edge.


DH

[Toppy Vann]

I would be interested to know what the Lions players think of their new coach. A continual failure to execute the basics and poor discipline tell me he's not gotten through. The top 4 CFL coaches I would identify as Austin, Hufnagel, Milanovich, and Jones.

* Milanovich's players play for him because he's the consummate "player's coach." They're an underdog team that's been handed a raw deal and he has their back.
* Jones' players buy into his arrogance and "the Eskimo way" - which roughly translates to "screw tradition. We're doing things our own way."
* Huff's guys respect his knowledge, but I get the sense they do well because they're more talented and have very good assistant coaches.
* Austin's guys are probably afraid of him because he's bat-sh*t crazy! LOL. They play with an edge.


DH

Your Austin description made me laugh.

Because you asked what Austin's players thought, TSN delivered this:

http://www.tsn.ca/cfl/video/ticats-embr ... yle~687355

Again as with Calgary and Toronto as examples the players echo similar themes of the coaches.

I've tried to listen to this with Tedford but it's like listening to what Jimmy Carter's vision for America was when he was President. Unclear.

Note the number of times Austin credits his coaches and the benefit of it is better with longevity (raising in my mind how long can he keep Steinhauer?). Players says he doesn't address the team every day but when he does it is the same few themes so as they say by the end of the year they haven't tuned him out. Players say Austin lets their coaches coach. Condell says he lets the assistants hire their coaches but accountability is key.

What would Austin do with Manny ARSEneaux. Later he talks of the need to give the players the freedom to fail with the proviso that they have to be learning from it. He says it's about the pattern of behavior as players and coaches are accountable for growth. If not learning and not growing and the basic tenets (which are few ) aren't met you move on.

[WestCoastJoe]

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/foot ... story.html

From Iain McIntyre ...

... the bottom line is that running back Andrew Harris the last couple of games — and especially against Montreal — was given the ball on first down and run up between the tackles against seven or eight defenders who knew the run was coming and simply overwhelmed the Lions’ offensive line.

There is little misdirection, no deception, no diversity in runners. There is only three yards and a cloud of dust, although there isn’t any dirt on artificial turf and Harris actually averaged only 1.25 yards on his eight carries against Montreal.

Receiver Shawn Gore beat Harris’s net rushing total with 11 yards on his only carry, which was also the only time beleaguered quarterback Travis Lulay was told by Cortez to give the ball to anyone but Harris.

Compare that variety to the Alouettes’ diversity — seven different runners combined for 251 yards. Sure, Montreal ran it up the gut too, but also unleashed different jet sweeps and quarterback options and generally looked like the innovative team that the Lions were expected to be on offence. And Montreal head coach Tom Higgins still got fired!

Lions defenders have allowed opposing quarterbacks to complete 41 of 50 passes against them the last two games. The Lions, meanwhile, are last in the CFL in sacks — a stat Buono has always downplayed.

It’s a superficial thing perhaps, but after the Lions were humiliated in Hamilton — remember, B.C. was down 21-0 before it generated a first down, lost Elimimian to a serious injury, then surrendered 50 points in a regular season game for the first time since Buono arrived before the 2003 season — their locker-room was not quite funereal.

There was quiet banter among a few players, even a couple of jokes and muffled laughs. Buono, of course, is now the general manager, not the head coach. But on a night like that, I’d have never expected that atmosphere in his locker-room.

[MexicoLionFan]

http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/foot ... story.html

From Iain McIntyre ...

... the bottom line is that running back Andrew Harris the last couple of games — and especially against Montreal — was given the ball on first down and run up between the tackles against seven or eight defenders who knew the run was coming and simply overwhelmed the Lions’ offensive line.

There is little misdirection, no deception, no diversity in runners. There is only three yards and a cloud of dust, although there isn’t any dirt on artificial turf and Harris actually averaged only 1.25 yards on his eight carries against Montreal.

Receiver Shawn Gore beat Harris’s net rushing total with 11 yards on his only carry, which was also the only time beleaguered quarterback Travis Lulay was told by Cortez to give the ball to anyone but Harris.

Compare that variety to the Alouettes’ diversity — seven different runners combined for 251 yards. Sure, Montreal ran it up the gut too, but also unleashed different jet sweeps and quarterback options and generally looked like the innovative team that the Lions were expected to be on offence. And Montreal head coach Tom Higgins still got fired!

Lions defenders have allowed opposing quarterbacks to complete 41 of 50 passes against them the last two games. The Lions, meanwhile, are last in the CFL in sacks — a stat Buono has always downplayed.

It’s a superficial thing perhaps, but after the Lions were humiliated in Hamilton — remember, B.C. was down 21-0 before it generated a first down, lost Elimimian to a serious injury, then surrendered 50 points in a regular season game for the first time since Buono arrived before the 2003 season — their locker-room was not quite funereal.

There was quiet banter among a few players, even a couple of jokes and muffled laughs. Buono, of course, is now the general manager, not the head coach. But on a night like that, I’d have never expected that atmosphere in his locker-room.

Thanks so much Joe for posting this...there is a problem with the culture of the Lions' football team, which is surprising as all heck because Day 1, that's all Tedford talked about...he wanted coaches and players that wanted to win, could think and process quickly on their feet, and played hard...I haven't witnessed much of that at all. As much as Wally's shadow looms all over this team, Tedford is still the HC and needs to, at the very least, start establishing a positive culture that doesn't tolerate failure. Another big loss to MTL on the road, and this thing could get real ugly in a hurry...to be honest, I don't think we have seen the bottom of this team yet.

[MexicoLionFan]

And looking at the Lions "2nd half" schedule, the best I can see this team doing is 3-7, which would put them at 6-12 for the season without direction, a DLine or a future at QB.