About our defence - Wally is sounding like the Lions DC

[WestCoastJoe]

I re-watched the first half of last week's game. The B.C. defence played a great half, using a lot of man coverage and keeping Bighill and Elimimian in the box. They held the Riders to 11 yards net offence in the first quarter and 174 yards overall in the half, 40 of which came on the last play as time expired.

In the second half, when the Lions were playing a soft zone to protect the lead, the Riders picked up 327 net yards and 16 first downs.

This defence can be effective when allowed to play straight up. I hope that as the new DBs settle into their roles and make fewer mistakes, the coaches will not see the need to give them extra help.

That is encouraging. The Argos will be a good test. As noted a few times, Mark W has the buy in of the players. If we keep giving up 400 or 500 yards of offence, however, one would expect doubts to accumulate.

[David]

I was less concerned about our defense after last game than I was in the first match-up vs the Riders (at BC Place).

Not saying they were stellar, but I agree with BC FAN, the Riders really weren't able to do the things they wanted to in the first half and were largely shut down by the Leos' defense. Some great route running by Dressler in the 2nd half opened up more things for them and we played very loose zone.

The Riders numbers were skewed by a few big plays, including a 49-yard run by Anthony Allen at the end of the half. I think the 2nd half Rider 'comeback' kind of tainted everyone's impression of our defensive effort. The biggest concerns I have right now are stopping teams from getting a first down on 2nd and long, and taking away points in the red zone.



DH

[WestCoastJoe]

We give up way too many conversions on 2nd down.

We are vulnerable in the red zone.

Our blitzes are telegraphed. Hello, offence, are you ready? Here we come.

We make Biggie and Sollie reactive defensive players, chasing, playing zone or space. They are not getting to be predators. They are usually in chase position.

We stretch Biggie and Sollie so thin. We expect them to make superhuman plays. But what if they get nicked? There is no one that can play in the way we ask of them. In fact, it seems to me, we might be wasting their talents. With all the running they do, they must be gassed after the game.

We do not attack an offence, even though Mark W says there are other ways to attack without blitzing. Great. Put Bighill back 25 yards. That won't scare anyone's Grandma.

Even with our prevent style defence we gave up many passing plays for over 30 yards to the Argos. No pressure kills.

At least Mark W tried to mix it up. But we do not attack. We react. We chase. We do not collapse the pocket and cause panic.

We do not pressure the quarterback. Trevor Harris finally figured out what we are doing, and he killed our zone. Gurley ate us up. Owens was not 100%. Elliott ate us up. The offence can find holes all over the field. True they have to be accurate, but these QBs are accurate. This is the modern day. We got lit up.

You give Trevor Harris time with those big, mobile receivers, and you will get lit up. The Argos trailed big time early. The probably could have run the ball well too, but they had to play catch up.

We play soft, vanilla zone. We put a little bit of neapolitan in there tonight. To little avail.

What kind of defence are we going to get this year? We are seeing it, methinks.

Someone sold Jeff Tedford on Mark Washington. I guess that would be Wally.

Oh yeah, and Darryl Waud looked pretty good on defence for the Argos. Contributing. Not a project for some time in the distant future like our pick. I cannot imagine that Kelly Bates would have allowed us to draft a project in the first round. No, no, wait a minute. Let's rethink this. Should he be that high on our board? He is much, much lower on other boards.

[dat]

Does anyone understand the rationale of having Craig Roh who is a natural defensive end and weighing about 260 in the defensive tackle spot and Westerman who is listed at 285 and used to be in the defensive tackle position now at defensive end ? Roh has a good pedigree, wouldn't it make more sense to have Roh on the end and Westerman back inside at their natural positions ? It's like when Keron Williams had a couple of really good seasons with quite a few sacks at defensive end and then the Lions decided they wanted him to play inside where he wasn't as effective. I'd like to see them at least try it out against Winnipeg for awhile. We need some sacks !

dat

[TheLionKing]

That might well happen as Zach Minter is due back for the Winnipeg game.

[WestCoastJoe]

From Lowell Ullrich ...

http://www.theprovince.com/sports/footb ... story.html

B.C. simply is not getting enough pressure, and can’t afford to send linebackers Adam Bighill, who had a whopping 14 tackles, and Solomon Elimimian because of the Lions’ coverage issues.

Toronto’s Trevor Harris wasn’t sacked Friday. The Lions are last in the league with just three sacks from four games. So far, the pass rush is less effective than last year, which ended with Tedford dumping experienced players for youth.

“We’ve got to somehow get pressure on the quarterback,” concurred Tedford, who has rookie Zach Minter, an NFL signee, on the 46-man roster but has dressed the same seven-man rotation for four games.

“We had some pressure but (Harris) stepped up in the pocket. Pressure is causing errant throws, but sacks would be nice.”

5 OL, a QB and a Running Back. That leaves 5 receivers. So, at some times, the D could send 7 men in to rush. Yes, you have to account for the RB.

5 OL and a QB. 6 receivers. The D could send 6 men in to rush.

5 OL, a QB, and 2 backs. 4 receivers. The D could send 8 in to rush, keeping an eye on the backs as well of course. Some teams do it.

Some teams manage to blitz effectively, without giving up much.

Some teams manage to disguise their intentions. Some teams move around at the LOS. Some teams fake the blitz effectively. Some teams stunt and loop effectively. Some teams create overloads effectively. Some teams get sacks. IMO, that is attack football, based on blitzing.

Can we do it? If we don't believe we can do it, then we cannot do it.

If it is not in our nature to do it, or if it is not somewhere in our philosophy to do it, then we cannot do it.

[WestCoastJoe]

Lions @ RedBlacks July 4

Henry Burris -- Passing (comp/att/yds) 23/29/296
Receiving (rec/yds) 23/296
Rushing (att/yds) 31/141

Burris and Walker

.........................

Riders @ Lions July 10

Kevin Glenn -- Passing (comp/att/yds) 23/29/271
Receiving (rec/yds) 23/271
Rushing (att/yds) 24/171

Glenn, Messam and Allen
..................

Lions @ Riders July 17

Kevin Glenn -- Passing (comp/att/yds) 24/40/360
Receiving (rec/yds) 24/360
Rushing (att/yds) 20/157

Glenn, Messam and Allen
...........

Argos @ Lions July 24

Trevor Harris -- Passing (comp/att/yds) 30/40/340
Receiving (rec/yds) 30/340
Rushing (att/yds) 16/53

Whitaker with only 35 on the ground, as the Argos were in catch up mode, flying down the field, rather than taking the ground route.
.................

This looks on paper, and on film, like a very porous defence. Vulnerable to the run, because we give too much responsibility for pass coverage to Bighill and Elimimian. Vulnerable to the pass because we do not put pressure on the Quarterback, as once again, we are hanging back in pass coverage.

Our infrequent blitzes are easily picked up.

[WestCoastJoe]

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/sports/index.html

Winnipeg this week. I was thinking it was Edmonton. They come to Vancouver the week after.

About their HC, Chris Jones. His record certainly seems to show he can coach a defence. And as HC, he is very decisive. He coaches like one tough summagun.

Jones set the tone for the players. He was in charge. If you had a problem with the coach or a coach on his staff, then you addressed him. If a player/coach issue came up, there would be no interference from Hervey, unlike his predecessor Eric Tillman. Jones implemented quicker-paced practices, and most importantly, a swagger on the field.

Now, 20 months later the Eskimos are once again among the top teams in the league.

They have the league’s best defence, but only one player, Pat Watkins, is in the top 28 in tackles. Jones rotates his D-line and linebackers regularly, and constantly talks about “the team.” He isn’t concerned about individual success, he only focuses on team success.

Rotating the D Line. It took us years to get to that point.

Rotating the LBs.

Jones instilled a belief in his team that had been lacking for almost a decade, and while some deem him cocky, arrogant, brash or boastful, no one can argue with his success.

He is a coach who gambles on third down. He fakes punts from midfield.

This fan likes it. Do they all work? No. That is not the point. The point is "going for it." The attitude it instills in your team. IMO Jones shares this attitude with Don Matthews. Recall Matthews using an onside kick, which failed, in pretty much his first appearance as the Lions' HC. Livin' on the Edge.

He isn’t afraid to bench a veteran, Odell Willis, for taking an undisciplined penalty. On Saturday, he pulled Matt Nichols, his starting quarterback, when the Eskimos were leading because, “I felt we needed a change of pace.”

After the game Jones didn’t want to discuss the switch.

... when asked about the decision to pull Nichols, he becomes a savvy politician. “We just decided as a staff that was the time. It wasn’t anything Nichols did or Franklin did. We won’t expand on anything. They both did a good job for us and we got a team win.”

I agree. He does not have to go into detail about a sensitive matter. To do so would just feed the media probing.

Jones also doesn’t hide behind the fact his team’s success begins with the defence. The Eskimos surrendered the fewest points last season, 18.8 per game, and this season they are allowing a league low 14.5 per game.

About his defence ...

I don't like his attitude to the media. I don't like his not shaking hands with the other HC after the game. But the man can coach up a storm.

[DanoT]

I'm pretty sure I've seen Jones shake hands post game with at least some opposing coaches.

[Blitz]

I'm pretty sure I've seen Jones shake hands post game with at least some opposing coaches.

Jones changed his thoughts regarding the post game handshake in the off-season and shakes hands with opposing coaches at the end of games this year.

[WestCoastJoe]

I'm pretty sure I've seen Jones shake hands post game with at least some opposing coaches.

Yes. The first one was his good friend in Winnipeg, Mike O'Shea. And that was kind of accidental, according to Jones.

I'm pretty sure I've seen Jones shake hands post game with at least some opposing coaches.

Jones changed his thoughts regarding the post game handshake in the off-season and shakes hands with opposing coaches at the end of games this year.

Good.
..........

Bud Grant did not shake hands. But he would usually wave to the other coach.

I think Don Matthews did not always do it.

But I think it looks better. Fight hard during the game. Friends after. Or at least respect after.

[DanoT]

Re: the post game handshake:
With a league as small as the CFL and the way coaches move around and get recycled it is wise to have a relationship with others who may end up one day as your boss, employee, or coworker.

[Toppy Vann]

Re: the post game handshake:
With a league as small as the CFL and the way coaches move around and get recycled it is wise to have a relationship with others who may end up one day as your boss, employee, or coworker.

I'm torn on the post game hand shake involving coaches and I've coached sports (youth soccer and baseball and senior mens soccer).

I didn't let my mens' teams do 3 cheers but I'd walk out and say something and send them to the handshake. I'd stand and watch and IF their players or coaches wanted to approach I'd certainly move to shake it out. Sometimes it was just a wave.


---

Jones has done well as a HC and again his decision to change QBs to Franklin didn't need to be justified to fans but definitely he needs to be in communication with his QB which it sounds like he hasn't. The top coaches keep lines of communication open espec to QBs.

---

The DEF stats view of Wally is that it is all down to two things: breakdowns and dumb penalties.

Not a whiff of any tactical needs to change but then again Wally is going to resist sounding like a second guesser.

All this stuff that Mike B couldn't coach the team his way was just bleep poop IMO. It was not a good choice as HC. You know Wally is angry with penalties and we know he puts the focus solely on players even when the whole football world says the lions are predictable. Eventually Wally 'fessed up and they changed.

Thus it's unlikely that he will ever finger MW for failing - certainly not mid season - as he is WB's guy unlike when he dumped Kruck for the return of JC.

[Rammer]

Lionbackers concerns going into the season about the DL and QB pressure are simply hurting the Lions even moreso this season with the new rule that prevents the DB's to engage with a receiver after the 5 yard zone. That the Lions also give up large chunks of real estate on the ground gives you an indication that our DL is being manhandled. Mark Washington your job is on the line...literally.

[WestCoastJoe]

Bombers get 389 yards on offence. Worst offence in the league shreds our defence.

Willy runs 5 times for 72 yards.

Last week they had ten two and outs. This week two.

We give up huge 2nd conversions.

Chris R is doing nothing, in position 30 yards deep. Can't cover. Can't react to the ball. Can't make a tackle. Time for Eric Fraser?

Soft zone. It stops nothing. It hopes the offence screws up.

Our guys are looking confused. Our guys are looking discouraged.

We are in the mess now. Any way out? This year? Hard to see it. You cannot make a tiger out of a pussycat attitude. Soft zone is a pussycat defence. It is just v e r y ... s o f t.

But it is what Wally prefers, and it is what Mark W has for his comfort zone, the soft zone. The heat must be getting to him though.

Just IMO ...