TiCats 19 - Lions 17 Post Game Stats and Comments

[B.C.FAN]

Ther Lions were probably in a no-win position, backed up inside their own 10-yard-line, facing a stiff breeze and a strong Hamilton return game that likely would have set the Cats up in field goal position at least if the Lions had punted. But conceding the safety also set up a chain of events that led to seven Hamilton points.
- The Lions conceded the safety (2 points)
- The Lions kicked off into the wind from their 25 . Hamilton got good position near midfield and punted the ball back inside the B.C. 10-yard line.
- The Lions conceded the second safety (2 points)
- The Lions kicked off into the wind from their own 25. Hamilton got good field position and drive to the one-yard-line before settling for a field goal (3 points)

If the Lions had punted instead of conceding the first safety, they would likely have given up a field goal (3 points) but would have been able to scrimmage the ball at their own 35 yard line and likely would not have given up the second safety and field goal. Conceding the first safety put them in a field-position hole that they couldn't escape and cost them the game.

[cromartie]

Along with Blitz's and BCFAN"s detailed game posts, Joe's Diary is the best thing on this board!!! TLK, Blitz, Cro, Nota, Sammy, Dano I would love if some of you did that as well!

Here was mine from last week:

Overnight guests clear out of the house about 5 Eastern.

-Pour myself a glass of almond milk and pop open a bag of vegan sugar cookies. Begins entering expense reports.

-Earth Fare makes some really good vegan cookies. I'm eating way too many of these in one sitting.

-Game notifier goes off on The Score app. And the BC Lions app. And the CFL app. And my phone calendar.

-Aware that I have a 6 a.m. Sunday morning flight

-Should I watch the game, or get some sleep? I have a long night of doing laundry and housecleaning.

-Realizes Khari Jones is still our offensive coordinator.

-Sets alarm for 11:30 p.m.

-Wakes up to find BC lost 19-17.

-Doesn't regret decision to nap instead.


All kidding aside, these sort of 'stream of consciousness' notes are a good idea. I'll try to keep one for subsequent games as well. I'm with Blitz that we may be better suited to keeping them in a separate thread, however.

[MexicoLionFan]

Great stuff Cro...our household is filled with similar products as well...we all drink almond milk!

Thanks Joe, Blitz and BCFAN for the comments and quotes...ANY HC, we all know this, makes sure that when a unit retakes the field they are doing exactly what he wants...O, D and S Ts...no excuses!

Paul McCallum knows that this is his last season in BC, likely the CFL so he is beginning to open his mouth and speak truth...3 nuggets from Paul after the game describe accurately what is going on the BC sideline...CHAOS and poor communication...that's ALL on the HC, no one else! Also Paul makes it clear that very few players have confidence right now...a VERY bad situation, especially for Kevin Glenn who might not survive the last 4 games...

[Lions4ever]

I pin this loss on Bene. The defence is playing well, you've got a punter who can boot the stitches off the ball, and you insist on giving up back to back safeties that turn a 5 point lead into a situation where a field goal beats you?? Punt the ball, put one of the leagues best defences on the field and let them hold the Ticats to a FG that would still leave the Lions in the lead. Worst case, they score a TD and you are no worse off than the Lions ultimately ended up being, but with a lot more time left on the clock. MB gives away 4 points and then when the Ticats do manage to kick a FG they win. Brutal coaching decisions from a HC that is proving to be more and more that he was never ready this job.

Yes I agree with you on this one. Where Benny really failed was when he later stated their was confusion and he did not want to concede the second safety. As soon as they first made the decision to concede the first safety I was thinking that if they go two and out on the next series they could be in the same situation. I was trying to figure out what they would do if that would occur again? It seems Benny never even gave this a thought as he was to busy pacing the field clapping. Note to Benny: Clapping doesn't do it try figuring out all the scenarios that may pop up in the game and be prepared for them.

We are of the same mind here. I get the occasional strategic benefit of the conceded safety, but man, I sure hate that tactic. I really feel like it was a momentum shifter last week and I think it was a huge blunder this week. Kick away and play stout D. Instead, mixed signals or not, Bene gave them 4 free points and they lost by 2. So dumb.

[WestCoastJoe]

Three kinds of decision makers / coaches.

Those that are prepared for whatever happens.

Those that make it happen.

Those that ask: "What just happened?"

Here is what happened.....according to the Province WCJ and confirms what you wrote...we were not prepared and there was confusion

Coach Mike Benevides was virtually forced to give up one safety Saturday with his offence sputtering in the fourth quarter and facing a 26-km/h breeze. He did not want to give up a second, however, but that message was never relayed in a proper fashion to punter Ricky Schmitt.

D'oh ... (smacks head)

“The first one was clear; we were supposed to take a knee. The second one was a debate,” Benevides said. “We could have punted it and it wasn’t communicated to Schmitty, but it was irrelevant at that point.”

"irrelevant" ... Hardly irrelevant, one thinks.

Debate? No decision card to reference? Who the heck is debating? D'oh.

Benevides opted to keep his defence on the field a couple of times when the Ticats were in punt formation, thinking Hamilton was up to something.

Confusion was apparent, and the lack of mental focus on the unit coached by special teams co-ordinator Chuck McMann was cited after the game by kicker Paul McCallum.

That's a beauty. LOL Scared to get tricked. But not prepared either. Better go full defence.

Schmitt fared reasonably well dealing with the wind, but the Lions cover units did not, giving up three returns in excess of 26 yards and 199 in all. That enabled Hamilton to flip adverse field position too often.

And at least one huge return called back.

Confusion reigns. Well, I guess one could say that confusion rains, also, as in rains down on our heads. Pretty sad, but this is our team.

[Blitz]

"Pour myself a glass of almond milk and pop open a bag of vegan sugar cookies".
cromartie

Man, your football snacks sure sound more tasty cro than my usual 3 meat pizza and tequila/sprite/lime

Sounds like your own special tailgater goin' on at your place.

Be interesting this week to see if we go with the 3 International lineman or whether we add a third import receiver to the mix instead. Any thoughts on this one cro?

Fabian has been in and out of the lineup - he looked so good last year before his injury. Not sure whether he has not fully recovered from his knee reconstruction (mentally or physically) or whether its just the usual downhill slide that all offensive lineman experience after playing for Dorazio. Valli was at this best in 2011, as our starting guard in a Grey Cup winning offence. Olifoye's best season was his first at right tackle. Norman played his best early. Hunter Steward was phenomenal in his first few games but I dread how he will be playing a couple of years from now if Dorazio remains in place.

[Belize City Lion]

I pin this loss on Bene. The defence is playing well, you've got a punter who can boot the stitches off the ball, and you insist on giving up back to back safeties that turn a 5 point lead into a situation where a field goal beats you?? Punt the ball, put one of the leagues best defences on the field and let them hold the Ticats to a FG that would still leave the Lions in the lead. Worst case, they score a TD and you are no worse off than the Lions ultimately ended up being, but with a lot more time left on the clock. MB gives away 4 points and then when the Ticats do manage to kick a FG they win. Brutal coaching decisions from a HC that is proving to be more and more that he was never ready this job.

Yes I agree with you on this one. Where Benny really failed was when he later stated their was confusion and he did not want to concede the second safety. As soon as they first made the decision to concede the first safety I was thinking that if they go two and out on the next series they could be in the same situation. I was trying to figure out what they would do if that would occur again? It seems Benny never even gave this a thought as he was to busy pacing the field clapping. Note to Benny: Clapping doesn't do it try figuring out all the scenarios that may pop up in the game and be prepared for them.

We are of the same mind here. I get the occasional strategic benefit of the conceded safety, but man, I sure hate that tactic. I really feel like it was a momentum shifter last week and I think it was a huge blunder this week. Kick away and play stout D. Instead, mixed signals or not, Bene gave them 4 free points and they lost by 2. So dumb.

With THIS team, the way they have been playing on defence compared to our anemic offence, which group would you rather have on the field when it's time to make a few big plays and win a game? Not the guys who have the ball.

[Toppy Vann]

I pin this loss on Bene. The defence is playing well, you've got a punter who can boot the stitches off the ball, and you insist on giving up back to back safeties that turn a 5 point lead into a situation where a field goal beats you?? Punt the ball, put one of the leagues best defences on the field and let them hold the Ticats to a FG that would still leave the Lions in the lead. Worst case, they score a TD and you are no worse off than the Lions ultimately ended up being, but with a lot more time left on the clock. MB gives away 4 points and then when the Ticats do manage to kick a FG they win. Brutal coaching decisions from a HC that is proving to be more and more that he was never ready this job.

Yes I agree with you on this one. Where Benny really failed was when he later stated their was confusion and he did not want to concede the second safety. As soon as they first made the decision to concede the first safety I was thinking that if they go two and out on the next series they could be in the same situation. I was trying to figure out what they would do if that would occur again? It seems Benny never even gave this a thought as he was to busy pacing the field clapping. Note to Benny: Clapping doesn't do it try figuring out all the scenarios that may pop up in the game and be prepared for them.

We are of the same mind here. I get the occasional strategic benefit of the conceded safety, but man, I sure hate that tactic. I really feel like it was a momentum shifter last week and I think it was a huge blunder this week. Kick away and play stout D. Instead, mixed signals or not, Bene gave them 4 free points and they lost by 2. So dumb.

Don Matthews was the guy who invented taking a SAFETY routinely as in those days until he did too often to kill the end of a game the rule changed from keeping the ball to being required to kick it away.

I think the punter is a factor and if he can kick in the wind decently and the D is playing fine... punt it away. However the Cats did get some good kick returns on the day and the Lions ST unit is less that spectacular but giving up the points to lose the game that way looks bad as we look back.

[David]

Now that teams have to kick-off from the 25-yard line as opposed to the 35-yard line (a rule that was changed a few years ago), teams really have to think through this strategy before the game starts on a windy night. A good return from a kick-off (which seemed likely on a night that the Lions weren't covering kicks very well, and against two very skilled returners in Banks and Sinkfield) likely meant they were only a first down or so away from being in Medlock's range.

I don't blame Schmitt. Punters don't just default to taking a knee in the endzone; it must have come from someone. We may have ultimately given up a field goal by punting, but we would have been able to scrimmage from our 35-yard line.


DH

[Rammer]

Now that teams have to kick-off from the 25-yard line as opposed to the 35-yard line (a rule that was changed a few years ago), teams really have to think through this strategy before the game starts on a windy night. A good return from a kick-off (which seemed likely on a night that the Lions weren't covering kicks very well, and against two very skilled returners in Banks and Sinkfield) likely meant they were only a first down or so away from being in Medlock's range.

I don't blame Schmitt. Punters don't just default to taking a knee in the endzone; it must have come from someone. We may have ultimately given up a field goal by punting, but we would have been able to scrimmage from our 35-yard line.


DH

Also, being down 17 - 14 and going for a FG only ties the game, and likely changes their offensive strategy and our defensive strategy. Being down 17 - 16 meant that Hamilton was still going for points, in this case a FG, but would they have been as agressive if they were tied up at 17...I don't think so and our feild position would have been better. Game management is huge in a tight game like that, and the Lions allowed the game management to tip in Hamilton's favour by giving up the safety at 17 - 14.

No matter what though, our O had to get some first downs at any time in the fourth quarter and Glenn once again couldn't buy a first down for a quarter, when the Lions needed it.

[cromartie]

"Pour myself a glass of almond milk and pop open a bag of vegan sugar cookies".
cromartie

Man, your football snacks sure sound more tasty cro than my usual 3 meat pizza and tequila/sprite/lime

Sounds like your own special tailgater goin' on at your place.

Be interesting this week to see if we go with the 3 International lineman or whether we add a third import receiver to the mix instead. Any thoughts on this one cro?

Fabian has been in and out of the lineup - he looked so good last year before his injury. Not sure whether he has not fully recovered from his knee reconstruction (mentally or physically) or whether its just the usual downhill slide that all offensive lineman experience after playing for Dorazio. Valli was at this best in 2011, as our starting guard in a Grey Cup winning offence. Olifoye's best season was his first at right tackle. Norman played his best early. Hunter Steward was phenomenal in his first few games but I dread how he will be playing a couple of years from now if Dorazio remains in place.

At this point I think that if any offensive lineman has developmental problems, we can safely attribute it to coaching. And that really sticks out like a sore thumb when you reconcile the raw talent we have on the line (someone has done a very good job scouting) with the past history of busts that have populated this roster.

As for the O line vs. receiver question, if they did any self scouting from the last match up against Ottawa, they'll use an extra lineman to counter the stunt based pass rush that confounded them last time. Olafioye, in particular, did not have a good game but, to be fair, he was saddled with Husband as a starting Guard beside him. But I have no confidence this coaching staff will adjust to that, nor do I have confidence that on defense they'll do a better job of disguising the basic 2nd and long blitzes they run that Hank took advantage of (Bighill blitzes from the short side, Hank hits the receiver that runs to that spot for a first down), so let's say they use another International body at a skill position instead.

Traditionally, I've used the game day thread for stream of consciousness thoughts. But, since I'm DVRing this one and likely won't get to it until Monday, I would imagine I'll compile some thoughts WCJ style in the postmortem thread.

Once upon a time, I ate just like you but nowadays, my health demands I essentially eat as a vegetarian. So enjoy the pizza and alcohol while you can. (We have a local restaurant that makes tofu wings; breaded bits of tofu in a sweet BBQ sauce and vegan ranch dressing, which makes a great pre-game dinner).

[notahomer]

http://www.theprovince.com/sports/footb ... story.html

Now it sounds like Arceneaux is down too. Did not practice Tuesday and may not play Saturday.......


Weird quote, IMO, by Gore, in Lowell's piece.

"We don't need to get stepped on anymore" "We need to be challenged as individuals"....wonder what he means by that? Have they been stepped on by coaches, other teams/players, what? I realize I'm taking this quote out of context but I am genuinely interested in what he is trying to communicate by saying it... (I know he has his reasons and mean no disrespect to him or Ullrich---the quote just leaves me wanting more-)

[TheLionKing]

Interesting that Benevides refers Wally Buono as his "dear friend"

[DanoT]

I have used up my quota of free access to the Province on line and now must become a subscriber to view. So, can anyone reprint the article?

[Blitz]

I have used up my quota of free access to the Province on line and now must become a subscriber to view. So, can anyone reprint the article?

Here it is Dano!

Ullrich: Arceneaux, Yell the latest Lions to go down

Both players have ankle sprains and could miss the game at B.C. Place Stadium on Saturday against Ottawa

By Lowell Ullrich, The Province October 7, 2014


There’s a degree of perspective that is required to assess the current plight of the B.C. Lions, and there is the kind of analysis about their unparalleled injury situation that only the oldest player in the CFL can offer.
“They don’t make young players like they used to,” wisecracked kicker Paul McCallum, a 44-year-old who has taken fewer hits than any of his teammates over 22 seasons.
There’s also a degree of realism that can come from one of the leading underachievers on the Lions, receiver Shawn Gore, who admitted Tuesday that without some kind of performance reversal his team will make a hasty playoff exit this season.
It may not seem possible that things could get worse these days, yet that’s exactly what happened when receiver Emmanuel Arceneaux was among two more starters who missed practice because of ankle ligament damage suffered early in the Lions’ 19-17 loss to the Hamilton Tiger-Cats.
Arceneaux, who returned to throw a touchdown pass Saturday after he was injured early in the game, was joined in sick bay by cornerback Ronnie Yell, who had been replacing injured veteran Dante Marsh, because of an ankle sprain. Both players could be out Saturday when the Lions try to avoid an unthinkable loss to the Ottawa Redblacks at B.C. Place Stadium.
It’s possible that no injured regular will return, a partial byproduct of an upcoming bye week following the appearance of the 2-11 expansion team, including Stefan Logan and Tim Brown, two veterans whose familiarity with the offence could be a vital asset. If they weren’t all getting treatment, it seemed as if the Lions could have nearly ringed the field with their casualties at practice.
It means an assessment of the 7-7 Lions, facing the very real prospect of missing the playoffs for the first time since 1996, a difficult task for general manager Wally Buono at the end of the season if his team remains battered by injuries.
Said Buono, who cited kick coverage as his primary beef in Hamilton, of the Lions in their current state: “What do you expect?”
The offence has clearly been impacted with the loss of Logan, Brown, Travis Lulay, Andrew Harris, Courtney Taylor, and Hunter Steward. And it has prompted players like Gore, the team’s most experienced remaining receiver, to state the obvious.
“If we keep playing the way we are, we’re going to lose if we get in the playoffs,” he said. “All criticism of us is due right now. It’s not welcome, but it’s due. I’m not making excuses.”
The current three-game losing streak is a purrfect storm for the offence, alternating between miscommunication between quarterback Kevin Glenn and his receivers, and play-calling by offensive co-ordinator Khari Jones. The protection of Glenn by the offensive line, a chronic problem for the Lions, has actually been better in the recent past.
But the base offensive unit lined up around Glenn besides Gore included Ernest Jackson, Kito Poblah and two rookies, Lavasier Tuinei and tailback Keola Antolin. The only other starting veteran in the backfield looked out at the group aligned around him Tuesday and couldn’t help but note the transformation.
When I go on a (road) trip I’m usually picking up Brown and Logan. Now I get to hang around with guys I wouldn’t have had to hang with in the past,” said fullback Rolly Lumbala, a blocker first and secret weapon second, who fulfils ratio needs with receiver S.J. Haidara.
It has put added strain on third-year coach Mike Benevides to find the proper motivational balance. B.C.’s defence remains tops against the pass but the offensive shortcomings are so acute the Lions still couldn’t beat Hamilton even with rookie nickleback Josh Johnson returning an interception for a touchdown.
Among the visual pointers offered by Benevides to his players before practice Tuesday was simply to show his team the league standings in both divisions, which would look better with a Lions win over Ottawa that would at least maintain a two-point cushion over Winnipeg, which plays at Edmonton Monday.
“We don’t need to be stepped on any more,” said Gore. “We need to be challenged as individuals.”
Typically, Benevides sees the prospect of playing a game without the Lions starting tailback, quarterback, two receivers and two returners as an opportunity,
“The challenge of injuries is nothing I’ve seen before so this is a new experience for me and my dear friend the GM,” Benevides said. “Are the walls caving in? No. It’d be different if we didn’t see a light at the end of the tunnel.”
Right now though, that light would be an ambulance driving another Lions player to hospital.
Injured Harris knows he has to be patient
A torn pectoral muscle has nothing on a separated ankle. Take it from Andrew Harris, who has suffered both injuries during his career with the B.C. Lions and realizes a long recovery period lies ahead.
“It’s pretty depressing,” Harris said after he and receiver Courtney Taylor spent time watching practice on crutches Tuesday.
“I’m an active guy and I can’t walk for two months, so that’s a struggle. The fact I have screws that have to be taken out after four months delays the whole process. If I do too much I have to go have surgery all over again.
“When I tore my pectoral (in 2011) I pushed it, but with this kind of injury I can’t be too pushy. It’s going to take a lot of patience.”
Harris said he will try to lend a hand to his replacement, Keola Antolin, in a manner similar to the involvement of injured quarterback Travis Lulay, who was doing one-handed pushups at practice Tuesday to test his injured shoulder.
Harris believes that once Antolin becomes comfortable, the rookie will be able to make a bigger impact than the 62 yards from scrimmage on 15 touches he managed in his debut against Hamilton.
For Harris, however, merely watching practice is difficult — and not just because he won’t play again this season.
“Just standing up for too long right now can be painful,” he said.
lullrich@theprovince.com