Can we be more CFL-positive?

[sj-roc]

As I recall, the minute flag was held up by a sideline official, for the last minute of each half, and lasted through maybe the 1980s or so. I don't remember there being any particular rules WRT time clock etc like there is under the currrent three minute warning; I think it was just an indication, like the flag lap in a car race or the bell lap in a cycling race.

The signal I remember for first down was an L shape: one arm straight up and the other one horizontal pointing in the direction the play was going. Second down was both arms held straight up in front of the chest, and third down was similar with the arms crossed.

Hmmm, don't recall these down signals at all. Must go a long way back.

About Labour Day: CFL season starts in June and ends in November, and all the games count the same. Labour Day to me means the end of August and beginning of September. We don't have kids, and though my wife works at UBC and has to deal with more students around it doesn't impact our lives otherwise. Despite what the news tells you, summer still runs to September 21, though those of us who hike like to hold onto the hiking season as long as we can.

Technically it runs until Sep 22 most years and even Sep 23 in some others.

http://www.timeanddate.com/calendar/seasons.html

[B.C.FAN]

The signal I remember for first down was an L shape: one arm straight up and the other one horizontal pointing in the direction the play was going. Second down was both arms held straight up in front of the chest, and third down was similar with the arms crossed.

Hmmm, don't recall these down signals at all. Must go a long way back.

I wish they still used the old arm signals. It's only in the past few years that I've noticed the shift the American-style finger signals. I guess with referees being mic'd and many TV viewers able to see close-ups of their finger signals, the CFL considered the full signals unnecessary. Still, there are many occasions when the referee's mic doesn't work and fans in the stands can't see his finger signals from afar. The current B.C. Place announcer often contributes to fan confusion by calling first down instead of third down, or vice versa. I'd rather rely on the referee to clearly signal the down in a way that people throughout the stadium can see.

[notahomer]

The signal I remember for first down was an L shape: one arm straight up and the other one horizontal pointing in the direction the play was going. Second down was both arms held straight up in front of the chest, and third down was similar with the arms crossed.

Hmmm, don't recall these down signals at all. Must go a long way back.

I wish they still used the old arm signals. It's only in the past few years that I've noticed the shift the American-style finger signals. I guess with referees being mic'd and many TV viewers able to see close-ups of their finger signals, the CFL considered the full signals unnecessary. Still, there are many occasions when the referee's mic doesn't work and fans in the stands can't see his finger signals from afar. The current B.C. Place announcer often contributes to fan confusion by calling first down instead of third down, or vice versa. I'd rather rely on the referee to clearly signal the down in a way that people throughout the stadium can see.

And it doesn't help, IMO, he frequently calls it a first down when its not. IOW, he gets it wrong, often enough.

I like the style in Investors Group field method. I know its not usally good form to make noise when on offence but the PA guy keys the crowd by saying "and that is good enough for another ....." and the crowd responds "FIRST DOWN" and then quiets, readying for the next play.........

[sj-roc]

And it doesn't help, IMO, he frequently calls it a first down when its not. IOW, he gets it wrong, often enough.

I like the style in Investors Group field method. I know its not usally good form to make noise when on offence but the PA guy keys the crowd by saying "and that is good enough for another ....." and the crowd responds "FIRST DOWN" and then quiets, readying for the next play.........

What I'm about to say isn't a criticism specifically of Matt Baker (our current PA announcer, who occasionally reads and even posts on this board), because I've noticed it from everyone who's held the post for as long as I can remember.

Anytime there's a QB change, it's always mentioned on the PA. This isn't always smart as we saw vs Ssk here last month: "Now in at QB, Travis Lulay." This drew a loud extended cheer from the crowd, which of course is counterproductive to our offence. Several players urged silence, but I think this only egged on the Ssk fans who were there, and that game had IMHO the loudest Ssk contingent I've ever heard @BCP — and I'm *including* playoff games here. I'd like to see this announcement discontinued, at least in this scenario. Fans will likely notice and cheer anyway but it wouldn't be as intense and sustained as with an announcement, which is practically an invitation to start cheering.

Do they so faithfully announce QB changes in all CFL stadiums? Or NFL ones, for that matter?

[DanoT]

I like the style in Investors Group field method. I know its not usally good form to make noise when on offence but the PA guy keys the crowd by saying "and that is good enough for another ....." and the crowd responds "FIRST DOWN" and then quiets, readying for the next play.........[/quote]

What was even better was that at Operation Orange in Winnipeg last year the Lions blew the Bombers out by scoring 50 points. So one person in the Operation Orange group would yell, "Another BC Lion"...and the rest of our group would shout "first down". While a lot of the Bomber fans left early in a lopsided game to beat the traffic, the first ones to leave were the bomber fans sitting around us.

Buck Pierce had just joined the Lions as a back up so when the game was well out of hand the Bomber fans started chanting "WE WANT PIERCE" so we joined in.

[notahomer]

What was even better was that at Operation Orange in Winnipeg last year the Lions blew the Bombers out by scoring 50 points. So one person in the Operation Orange group would yell, "Another BC Lion"...and the rest of our group would shout "first down". While a lot of the Bomber fans left early in a lopsided game to beat the traffic, the first ones to leave were the bomber fans sitting around us.

Buck Pierce had just joined the Lions as a back up so when the game was well out of hand the Bomber fans started chanting "WE WANT PIERCE" so we joined in.

It was such an amazing evening and I'm so glad I got to see it in person. Bighill picking up a fumble for a TD on one of the first plays after kickoff. In fact, IIRC, Biggie scored 17 points as did the entire Bomber roster! (I know, I'm over-simplfying things but the guy had an AWESOME night, as did his team-mates).

I still don't think were super obnoxious or anything. I never leave games, even if the Lions are on the losing end but I certainly understand and respect others choice to do so.

[Toppy Vann]

One of the reasons the CFL rules keep getting called into question is the CFL getting public discussions that lead to fans who get carried away with all things NFL and want to change the single point rules in our game. Few scream about the routine convert but fans go bizarrely idiotic if the ball is not dead for a missed FG and the opponent has to run it out. I've played both 4 and 3 downs and I disliked fair catches, lack of singles, smaller end zones in US rules.

The NFL gets a pass and they can take double the time to get the ball in play. I love watching Peyton Manning who makes that interesting with his calls but their time to get plays started is too long.

[Ravi]

There was one season in 2009 in which the CFL changed the scoring system with regards to after a successful field goal in which the team scored against must receive a kickoff as opposed to choosing to scrimmage from their own 35-yard line. I wonder if that was changed because of influence from the NFL. In any case, it was unpopular and was quickly changed back to the original system in 2010.

The NFL had no influence on that rule change from what I recall. Adam Rita was the one who came up with the idea as a way to keep more suspense in the game if a team was down by 9 to 11 points (i.e., they could kick a FG to get to within one score and then try an onside kick). Also, the kick return is one of the most exciting plays in the Canadian game (as opposed to the American one) and it was thought that we would see more big kick returns.

[Ravi]

Perhaps a very little known CFL rule is after a team has a field goal successfully scored against or scores a safety of their own, there are actually three options the team can choose:

1. Scrimmage on their own 35-yard line.
2. Receive a kickoff (from 35-yard line after a FG, 25-yard line after a Safety)
3. Kickoff from their own 35-yard line.

The third option is ridiculous and unpopular as it doesn't make sense at all to kick the ball away and give possession to the other team again so that option it's never chosen. I wonder why that option is still in the rule book in the CFL.

I was aware of this rule; AFAIK it also applies after TDs. I can imagine at least one scenario where it might be worth considering.

There's one second left in the game with a tied score after you just gave up a FG. You could win on a kickoff rouge. But unlike a regular (punt or MFG) rouge whereby you could simply kick it through the endzone without the receiving team even getting a hand on it, they have to at least touch it to bring the kickoff rouge into play and of course fail to get it back out before the play is dead, so this factor might hamper the inclination to kickoff.

But you could also score an "onside TD" in this scenario if you recover it yourself in goal. The decision on whether to kickoff yourself after surrendering a FG might also be sweetened if the opponent has taken one or more dead ball penalties after the FG. Especially if these are major fouls or DQs, which would greatly shorten how far your kickoff must travel, making the rouge or TD scoring attempt a higher percentage gambit (anyone remember that time a few years ago when we had the other team — the Argos, I think it was — kicking off from, I believe it was OUR 35? Our side of midfield at any rate).

There's also the psychological effect of catching the other team off-guard as they might not expect this unusual decision. They would likely expect a hail mary play from your 35 to get the TD (or a PI penalty and one extra shot). A surprise kickoff might catch their special teams coach scrambling to get their right personnel into place on the field.

Oh and thanks for clarifying that Indy/Balt issue. Do they still announce timeouts by naming the team rather than their O/D designation?

I can tell you guys of a situation back in 1979 when Saskatchewan played Ottawa at Taylor Field and the Ottawa Rough Riders kicked off to Saskatchewan late in the game after the western Riders had scored a TD on the eastern Riders to draw close. The reason why George Brancato decided to kickoff was because he was concerned about Saskatchewan successfully executing an onside kick (kickoffs back in those days were done at one's own 45 yard line too). The tactic worked as the eastern Riders were able to hem the western Riders in their end and there simply was not enough time on the clock for Saskatchewan to put together a game-winning drive. Some of that game can be seen on YouTube although not the part that I have just spoken of:

[JohnHenry]

We've gotten into some discussion recently about the business of fans wearing NFL gear at games; I've been clear that it doesn't bother me a great deal, nor should it really bother anyone. But there is one NFL-related matter that DOES kind of bother me that I'd like to broach.

I wish the people who cover the CFL, including and perhaps especially TSN (and I guess this would include TSN 1040), would quit making comments in their coverage that implicitly defer to the NFL as an absolute frame of football reference to which the CFL must constantly compare itself.

It happens all the time. Some examples:

"The football season doesn't really start until after Labour Day." I'm getting most tired of this one. Yes, that's when the *NFL* season starts. But it's like telling CFL fans, "Don't bother wasting your money buying tickets to any summer games." Is it just a coincidence that our attendance generally picks up in the latter half of the schedule? I think we hear this comment so often, that for some fans it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Maybe more people would attend these games if we quit telling they don't count, which isn't even true in the first place.

"You only need *ONE* foot in bounds in the CFL." This is often said of a catch almost out of bounds, and yes, they always emphasise the "*ONE*". The way this phrase gets invoked, you'd think every last person watching and listening to the commentary is aghast: "What?!?!?! Surely, that's not a catch because in the holy NFL you need BOTH feet down in bounds to make it count, so it MUST work the same way in th— oh wait, he just said you only need *ONE* foot so it's not the same rule as the NFL. Thank goodness he clarified that." I'd rather see this phrase more pro-actively framed, something like, "Arceneaux leaps, makes the catch and gets his foot [taking care to use the singular] down for another BC first down at the Ssk 27." See the difference? The large majority of regular viewers understand this rule on its own terms anyway.

"You only have three downs in the CFL." Another empty phrase that needlessly describes the CFL implicitly in NFL terms. The way this phrase gets mentioned so often, it's like we can't afford a 4th down, not enough money in the budget for it or something. Please get rid of it.

"The CFL has smaller rosters." Smaller than...? Yeah, you guessed it. This one is often invoked when a player, more renowned for his play in his regular role on offence or defence, makes a great special teams play, and so there seems to be this need to point out that the reason he also plays on special teams is *because*... well, you know. The comment has an apologetic tone. When they say, "The CFL has smaller rosters," what I hear between the lines is, "You never have NFL clubs cobbling their special teams together from mostly starters, but you see, here in the CFL, where we live in football squalor, this is the way we have to do it." The CFL has smaller rosters? No.... no, no. BASKETBALL has smaller rosters. Again, can't we put a more positive framing on it?

Let's say our MODP candidate just made a great special teams tackle. How about instead of handwringing over how the "smaller rosters" forces us to play him on special teams, we put it something like this: "You know, most people think of Solomon Elimimian and they think of his elite linebacking skills. But what some folks forget is that #56 brings you a lot more than that. Let's watch this punt again and just have a look at how he powers through Cgy's coverage unit and how quickly he gets downfield... yada yada yada. That's just pure instinct. You can't teach that. You can't coach it. And that's why Wally Buono just signed him to an extension." No apologising. Pump the guy up as being so valuable an asset to his team that he's out there on special teams because they WANT him, not because they're "forced" to use him on account of "smaller rosters".

These are just off the top of my head but this post is already long enough anyway. There are probably more of these tropes that we hear so often we don't even realise how negative they really are, and how much more positively the points that they try to make could be framed. Feel free to contribute your own.

If I were the guy replacing Cohon next year, I'd definitely want to put some resources into improving this aspect of the product. I know the CFL only has so much control over TSN, but the league and the network should work together on this for their own mutual benefit to improve the presentation of the product.

The CFL is a league that has developed organically on its own — largely in parallel to, and independent of, the NFL. But the way we so often hear the sort of aphorisms I've outlined above, one can come away with the false impression that the CFL was somehow devised merely as a latter-day Canadian version of a pre-established, mature NFL. Even in the absence of the version of the game currently enjoyed south of the border, I think Canadian football would still be around. Maybe not on as large as a scale as the CFL currently enjoys (vastly smaller talent pool, for starters), but it would still exist nonetheless, perhaps on a similar scale to curling.

You make some interesting points, sj. The CFL is constantly being compared to the NFL. They are a high standard to emulate, with revenues approaching $10 billion per year. The constant comparisons seem to be a growing trend...as Canadian football fans become more aware of the NFL year by year (their ratings have been growing steadily since being shown on TSN)...and realize the CFL is actually second tier, compared to the NFL.

I think many casual sports fans in Canada weren't aware the CFL was 2nd rate, many thinking the local CFL team was just a Canadian version of the NFL, perhaps affiliated in some way. With the constant haranguing about how terrific and successful the NFL is (and how cheap the CFL is by comparison, as was highlighted during the recent CBA negotiations)...the CFL light is perhaps dimming a bit in some people's eyes.

Often the Canadian media doesn't draw any differentiation between the Canadian and U.S. TV markets. They'll reprint stories from the U.S. about the terrific the NFL ratings are, with many fans assuming that must apply in Canada too. I've had many NFL-lovers sneer "the NFL is 10-times more popular than the CFL", according to the ratings they've read...not realizing those ratings were for a foreign country. Many Canadians, especially in southern Ontario, don't even see Canada as a separate market...what's popular in the U.S. applies in Canada equally.

The CFL is not unique among Canadian institutions being compared to their U.S. counterparts. I guess it boils down to the Canadian "inferiority complex". We are constantly looking for recognition and approval from our southern neighbours...if only to reaffirm our support for the things we like. But if the Americans don't like it...is it really that good?

[Ravi]

Can we please remove Rod Black from play-by-play on TSN telecasts and stop the almost constant NFL references during his telecasts? It made me sick on East Final Sunday when Black was droning on and on - for the upteenth time no less - about the fathers of Duron Carter and Luke Tasker as well as Chris Berman. As I said on Twitter, "Enough, enough, enough"! Why in the world did the TSN folks feel the need to show highlights of Cris Carter and Steve Tasker playing in the NFL? What the hell did that have to do with the East Final? I was nothing short of disgusted on Sunday and my great frustration was a culmination of over a decade of listening to the sub-par play-by-play of Rod Black who TSN persists in stuffing down our throats despite what must be the thousands upon thousands of complaints that they have received from CFL fans over the years. Sorry for the run-on sentence but I have had enough!!!

[WestCoastJoe]

Can we please remove Rod Black from play-by-play on TSN telecasts and stop the almost constant NFL references during his telecasts? It made me sick on East Final Sunday when Black was droning on and on - for the upteenth time no less - about the fathers of Duron Carter and Luke Tasker as well as Chris Berman. As I said on Twitter, "Enough, enough, enough"! Why in the world did the TSN folks feel the need to show highlights of Cris Carter and Steve Tasker playing in the NFL? What the hell did that have to do with the East Final? I was nothing short of disgusted on Sunday and my great frustration was a culmination of over a decade of listening to the sub-par play-by-play of Rod Black who TSN persists in stuffing down our throats despite what must be the thousands upon thousands of complaints that they have received from CFL fans over the years. Sorry for the run-on sentence but I have had enough!!!

X2.

I reached for the mute button when Black went to the NFL references. I suppose some fans want to hear that stuff. Not me.

Talk about the CFL. Talk about the game in front of you. Don't relate everything to the NFL. I am tuned in to watch a CFL game.

Rod Black means well, but I usually end up wishing it was any of the other guys calling the game.

[B.C.FAN]

Can we please remove Rod Black from play-by-play on TSN telecasts and stop the almost constant NFL references during his telecasts? It made me sick on East Final Sunday when Black was droning on and on - for the upteenth time no less - about the fathers of Duron Carter and Luke Tasker as well as Chris Berman. As I said on Twitter, "Enough, enough, enough"! Why in the world did the TSN folks feel the need to show highlights of Cris Carter and Steve Tasker playing in the NFL? What the hell did that have to do with the East Final? I was nothing short of disgusted on Sunday and my great frustration was a culmination of over a decade of listening to the sub-par play-by-play of Rod Black who TSN persists in stuffing down our throats despite what must be the thousands upon thousands of complaints that they have received from CFL fans over the years. Sorry for the run-on sentence but I have had enough!!!

That game was shown on the main ESPN network in the U.S., unlike most CFL games, which are shown on ESPN2 or online on ESPN3. I'm sure the broadcast crew was told to hype up the NFL references for the benefit of viewers who don't normally follow the CFL.

[ballhawk]

Can we please remove Rod Black from play-by-play on TSN telecasts and stop the almost constant NFL references during his telecasts? It made me sick on East Final Sunday when Black was droning on and on - for the upteenth time no less - about the fathers of Duron Carter and Luke Tasker as well as Chris Berman. As I said on Twitter, "Enough, enough, enough"! Why in the world did the TSN folks feel the need to show highlights of Cris Carter and Steve Tasker playing in the NFL? What the hell did that have to do with the East Final? I was nothing short of disgusted on Sunday and my great frustration was a culmination of over a decade of listening to the sub-par play-by-play of Rod Black who TSN persists in stuffing down our throats despite what must be the thousands upon thousands of complaints that they have received from CFL fans over the years. Sorry for the run-on sentence but I have had enough!!!

It kind of reminds me when Ricky Williams was in the league with Toronto, and for the CFL announcers covering the games, including the panels, it was Ricky Williams this, and Ricky Williams that - he was the greatest. The really sad thing is that during that year there were a number of other running backs in the league who did much better than Ricky, but hardly got the accolades or a mention. They were CFL and he was the great NFL running back. It was truly sad - an glimpse into the great Canadian inferiority complex. It runs deep.

[Rammer]

Can we please remove Rod Black from play-by-play on TSN telecasts and stop the almost constant NFL references during his telecasts? It made me sick on East Final Sunday when Black was droning on and on - for the upteenth time no less - about the fathers of Duron Carter and Luke Tasker as well as Chris Berman. As I said on Twitter, "Enough, enough, enough"! Why in the world did the TSN folks feel the need to show highlights of Cris Carter and Steve Tasker playing in the NFL? What the hell did that have to do with the East Final? I was nothing short of disgusted on Sunday and my great frustration was a culmination of over a decade of listening to the sub-par play-by-play of Rod Black who TSN persists in stuffing down our throats despite what must be the thousands upon thousands of complaints that they have received from CFL fans over the years. Sorry for the run-on sentence but I have had enough!!!

That game was shown on the main ESPN network in the U.S., unlike most CFL games, which are shown on ESPN2 or online on ESPN3. I'm sure the broadcast crew was told to hype up the NFL references for the benefit of viewers who don't normally follow the CFL.

If that is the main issues with Black, I must be missing something. He constantly misses what happens on the field, suggesting first down when it is obvious that the play didn't make it, and so on. He just likes talking for talkings sake, and after all the years of commentating, he still doesn't grasp basic things.