So I guess I will be wearing my Tiger-Cat John Barrow #61 1965 Grey Cup worn jersey to the Grey Cup.
.
Who to cheer for/against?
Moderator: Team Captains
-
DanoT
- Hall of Famer
- Posts: 4316
- Joined: Mon Sep 17, 2007 6:38 pm
- Location: Victoria, B.C. in summer, Sun Peaks Resort in winter
I grew up in Burlington and Hamilton and went to Westdale High School, (same as Jim Young who was my substitute teacher in the mid sixties.)
So I guess I will be wearing my Tiger-Cat John Barrow #61 1965 Grey Cup worn jersey to the Grey Cup.
.
So I guess I will be wearing my Tiger-Cat John Barrow #61 1965 Grey Cup worn jersey to the Grey Cup.
.
-
TheLionKing
- Hall of Famer
- Posts: 25103
- Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 10:13 pm
- Location: Vancouver
I just want to see an entertaining high scoring game instead of a defensive battle that we've become accustomed to this season.
-
South Pender
- Legend
- Posts: 2779
- Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 9:24 am
- Location: Vancouver weekdays; Gulf Islands on weekends
I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
A Stamps win though would allow Hufnagel to step up to GM only, as a Grey Cup HC winner. That would open the door to DD assuming the Stampeder HC job, something that I really hoped would fall into the Lions lap.South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
Entertainment value = an all time low
I wonder what the outcome would mean (in either case) for the likelihood of WB getting DD out of Cgy, or even WB's interest in doing so?South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
Sports can be a peculiar thing. When partaking in fiction, like a book or movie, we adopt a "Willing Suspension of Disbelief" for enjoyment's sake. There's a similar force at work in sports: "Willing Suspension of Rationality". If you doubt this, listen to any conversation between rival team fans. You even see it among fans of the same team. Fans argue over who's the better QB or goalie, and selectively cite stats that support their views while ignoring those that don't.
Ah, you anticipated my question.Rammer wrote:A Stamps win though would allow Hufnagel to step up to GM only, as a Grey Cup HC winner. That would open the door to DD assuming the Stampeder HC job, something that I really hoped would fall into the Lions lap.South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
Sports can be a peculiar thing. When partaking in fiction, like a book or movie, we adopt a "Willing Suspension of Disbelief" for enjoyment's sake. There's a similar force at work in sports: "Willing Suspension of Rationality". If you doubt this, listen to any conversation between rival team fans. You even see it among fans of the same team. Fans argue over who's the better QB or goalie, and selectively cite stats that support their views while ignoring those that don't.
We are on the same wave length alright, and I do think that the games outcome does impact any slim chance of prying DD out of Calgary.sj-roc wrote:Ah, you anticipated my question.Rammer wrote:A Stamps win though would allow Hufnagel to step up to GM only, as a Grey Cup HC winner. That would open the door to DD assuming the Stampeder HC job, something that I really hoped would fall into the Lions lap.South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
Entertainment value = an all time low
Okay, slight edge to Calgary JUST because they are the WEST champs....I referenced in a post above that Ham is returning to the Grey Cup after losing last year so I had a look at some stats pertaining to this dynamic.
Starting from the official CFL founding in 1958, and including Ham this year, the losing Grey Cup team has returned the following year on 23 occasions. The table below lists all of these teams and their results.
In general, losing Grey Cup teams who return the very next year have a rather good record at 14-8 so far since 1958. Ham's contribution to this stat, highlighted in yellow, is a more modest 4-3.
It so happens that this year's Grey Cup features not only last year's runner-up in Ham, but also the previous year's RU in Cgy; these circumstances represent a subset of the full data set above (noted with italics) and are examined in the last two columns. Overall since 1958, six Grey Cups have featured the two most recent RUs, with the more recent RU holding a fairly poor 1-5 record. The 1964 Lions are the only team in this era to have ever come off a GC loss to win it the following year against the team that had been the RU just before them.
It also turns out that for most of these — all but two of the six before this year — the game was actually a rematch of the previous year's matchup. For example, Ham prevailed over BC in 1963 (after losing in 1962 to Wpg), making the 1964 GC a rematch of the 1963 contest. This year is only the third time since 1958 that a Grey Cup has featured the two most recent RUs in a non-rematch. On both previous occasions, the more recent RU wound up posting back-to-back losses — with the Lions playing spoiler both times:
• 1984 RU Ham lost again in 1985 to 1983 RU BC.
• 2005 RU Mtl lost again in 2006 to 2004 RU BC.
So Ham has an opportunity to write a small bit of modern-era GC history with a win on Sunday. Maybe they have a better chance than the last two teams who found themselves in this position — since they're not facing BC. :haha:
Starting from the official CFL founding in 1958, and including Ham this year, the losing Grey Cup team has returned the following year on 23 occasions. The table below lists all of these teams and their results.
In general, losing Grey Cup teams who return the very next year have a rather good record at 14-8 so far since 1958. Ham's contribution to this stat, highlighted in yellow, is a more modest 4-3.
It so happens that this year's Grey Cup features not only last year's runner-up in Ham, but also the previous year's RU in Cgy; these circumstances represent a subset of the full data set above (noted with italics) and are examined in the last two columns. Overall since 1958, six Grey Cups have featured the two most recent RUs, with the more recent RU holding a fairly poor 1-5 record. The 1964 Lions are the only team in this era to have ever come off a GC loss to win it the following year against the team that had been the RU just before them.
It also turns out that for most of these — all but two of the six before this year — the game was actually a rematch of the previous year's matchup. For example, Ham prevailed over BC in 1963 (after losing in 1962 to Wpg), making the 1964 GC a rematch of the 1963 contest. This year is only the third time since 1958 that a Grey Cup has featured the two most recent RUs in a non-rematch. On both previous occasions, the more recent RU wound up posting back-to-back losses — with the Lions playing spoiler both times:
• 1984 RU Ham lost again in 1985 to 1983 RU BC.
• 2005 RU Mtl lost again in 2006 to 2004 RU BC.
So Ham has an opportunity to write a small bit of modern-era GC history with a win on Sunday. Maybe they have a better chance than the last two teams who found themselves in this position — since they're not facing BC. :haha:
Sports can be a peculiar thing. When partaking in fiction, like a book or movie, we adopt a "Willing Suspension of Disbelief" for enjoyment's sake. There's a similar force at work in sports: "Willing Suspension of Rationality". If you doubt this, listen to any conversation between rival team fans. You even see it among fans of the same team. Fans argue over who's the better QB or goalie, and selectively cite stats that support their views while ignoring those that don't.
-
South Pender
- Legend
- Posts: 2779
- Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 9:24 am
- Location: Vancouver weekdays; Gulf Islands on weekends
I realize that the zeitgeist on this forum is that DD would be a marvelous head coach for the Lions, but does the available evidence really strongly suggest this? Sure, he was a fine quarterback. And sure, he seems calm and composed on the sideline. And sure, he seems like a helluva nice guy. But is the Stampeders' offensive success primarily his--or could it be more Hufnagel's? He would certainly command respect and would be credible to players, having been successful himself as a pro (something that Bene was not), but I'm wondering whether we're seeing more there than may exist. Maybe a guy with more--and more varied--experience would be just as good or better (like Paul LaPolice). Just a thought.Rammer wrote:A Stamps win though would allow Hufnagel to step up to GM only, as a Grey Cup HC winner. That would open the door to DD assuming the Stampeder HC job, something that I really hoped would fall into the Lions lap.South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
-
Toppy Vann
- Hall of Famer
- Posts: 9794
- Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2005 12:56 pm
It's a strange year where a 9 and 9 HC is basking in the glory of GC week while the host city HC with the same record had is burning his hoodie.
I like the way both teams are coached and I think the Kent Austin we see as a HC and a few other roles is not the same Kent Austin who as a player was not always the first to look in the mirror for his own role - BUT like many successful coaches who when they transition to the role of HC realize that even their own behaviour as a player doesn't help a team consistently and they select and coach players to be team first.
I like how Austin refers to the staff when he speaks to the players and his happiness after the last game was not what you see from either Hufnagel or Dickinson it showed that players respect him and he is honest and sincere.
I like the Stamps coaching staff and how they speak of players and how that extends into the team. Even Jon Cornish has made a lot of changes in his narrative and he can be a bit of a loose cannon earlier on and say things in the heat of a game or after that are best not said.
I compare Huf'n'gl and DD on Kevin Glenn to the how poorly the MB spoke of him. Hufnagel when asked if Glenn was underrated (by Orlesky?) reacted quickly and politely in telling her- you're talking to the wrong guy. I don't underrate KG. Dickinson had similar comments but was more detailed in the situations they put him to be successful and win. Nik Lewis was a whole column worth of comments on Glenn and he as a team leader speaks for a lot of people and apparently his large fan following who actually hang out his place for parties at times.
Glenn post season says it was not his team. That narrative and thinking came from the top with the constant reference to losing their guy - Lulay.
In the end I hope to see a decent game and I'd not be unhappy with either team.
I like the way both teams are coached and I think the Kent Austin we see as a HC and a few other roles is not the same Kent Austin who as a player was not always the first to look in the mirror for his own role - BUT like many successful coaches who when they transition to the role of HC realize that even their own behaviour as a player doesn't help a team consistently and they select and coach players to be team first.
I like how Austin refers to the staff when he speaks to the players and his happiness after the last game was not what you see from either Hufnagel or Dickinson it showed that players respect him and he is honest and sincere.
I like the Stamps coaching staff and how they speak of players and how that extends into the team. Even Jon Cornish has made a lot of changes in his narrative and he can be a bit of a loose cannon earlier on and say things in the heat of a game or after that are best not said.
I compare Huf'n'gl and DD on Kevin Glenn to the how poorly the MB spoke of him. Hufnagel when asked if Glenn was underrated (by Orlesky?) reacted quickly and politely in telling her- you're talking to the wrong guy. I don't underrate KG. Dickinson had similar comments but was more detailed in the situations they put him to be successful and win. Nik Lewis was a whole column worth of comments on Glenn and he as a team leader speaks for a lot of people and apparently his large fan following who actually hang out his place for parties at times.
Glenn post season says it was not his team. That narrative and thinking came from the top with the constant reference to losing their guy - Lulay.
In the end I hope to see a decent game and I'd not be unhappy with either team.
"Ability without character will lose." - Marv Levy
Maybe, but since Wally holds the hammer here, we have to (or might as well) think like him if we want to engage in such a Gedankenexperiment.South Pender wrote:I realize that the zeitgeist on this forum is that DD would be a marvelous head coach for the Lions, but does the available evidence really strongly suggest this? Sure, he was a fine quarterback. And sure, he seems calm and composed on the sideline. And sure, he seems like a helluva nice guy. But is the Stampeders' offensive success primarily his--or could it be more Hufnagel's? He would certainly command respect and would be credible to players, having been successful himself as a pro (something that Bene was not), but I'm wondering whether we're seeing more there than may exist. Maybe a guy with more--and more varied--experience would be just as good or better (like Paul LaPolice). Just a thought.Rammer wrote:A Stamps win though would allow Hufnagel to step up to GM only, as a Grey Cup HC winner. That would open the door to DD assuming the Stampeder HC job, something that I really hoped would fall into the Lions lap.South Pender wrote:I'm hoping for a Stampeders win. Huff deserves another GC ring. The Stampeders have been the class of the CFL all season--easily the best team--and it would seem unfair, in a sense, if they lost to what is definitely an inferior team (something that can easily happen in a single game).
Not that we know for a fact that DD is atop his short list but that certainly seems to be the popular opinion.
Sports can be a peculiar thing. When partaking in fiction, like a book or movie, we adopt a "Willing Suspension of Disbelief" for enjoyment's sake. There's a similar force at work in sports: "Willing Suspension of Rationality". If you doubt this, listen to any conversation between rival team fans. You even see it among fans of the same team. Fans argue over who's the better QB or goalie, and selectively cite stats that support their views while ignoring those that don't.
-
South Pender
- Legend
- Posts: 2779
- Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2012 9:24 am
- Location: Vancouver weekdays; Gulf Islands on weekends
Not really interested in shrinking Wally's head. Just spitballing on possible candidates--Wally's preferences notwithstanding.sj-roc wrote:Maybe, but since Wally holds the hammer here, we have to (or might as well) think like him if we want to engage in such a Gedankenexperiment.
Not that we know for a fact that DD is atop his short list but that certainly seems to be the popular opinion.
Thanks for doing all that work sj-roc. Interesting to say the least.....sj-roc wrote:I referenced in a post above that Ham is returning to the Grey Cup after losing last year so I had a look at some stats pertaining to this dynamic. ............
Sure would be a bummer to go to the big game TWICE and lose but then again, I don't see any team matching the Buffalo Bills in terms of making it to the leagues championship game but then ending up losing...