Lions 41 - Alouettes 5 -- Post Game Stats and Comments

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Ravi
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PigSkin_53 wrote:Got supremely stiffed here in the east tonight as the game started off as Lions / Als, but soon was preempted by the Canada soccer lacrosse match

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!!!
Really? I wonder how that happened. I was able to see the football game in full in Ontario.
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WestCoastJoe
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Rammer wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:Some observations ...

Hunter Steward shows good lateral mobility, a key for a tackle. He seems like a smart player. The coaching staff obviously believes in him. Very solid performance by our O Line.

Nice game prep by Khari Jones. Some wonderful pitch running plays. Giants blocking out the sun around the corner. Including Lumbala laying waste to the D on the corner. Those little Alouettes were not liking those toss sweeps. LOL

Keven Glenn showing his quick strike ability when given a good game plan of pass protection. 4 sacks but one expects some sacks when a team goes all in as do the Alouettes. Just make them pay. And run the dayum ball down their throats. Which we did.

Defensively very solid. Khreem Smith. Eric Taylor. Bazzi showed some speed and pursuit.

Bighill and Solo as usual.

Kudos to Mark Washington for a very good game plan. Pressured Troy Smith into shutdown mode.

Ricky Schmitt pounds the kickoff down to the 5 yard line at times. When is the last time we saw that? Ummm ... Never.

I liked what I saw from Cameron Thorn last year at camp. Still looking good. Great late draft pick.

Well done, coaches. Including Mike Benevides.

Stats coming ...
Two things jump out at me in this game, the play of Williams, he has to be put on the field more, he just makes plays. Secondly, was this a game that Cox showed up at? He was as quiet as I have ever seen him in a game, that is all on the Lions 'executing' the gameplan to a tee.
Cox seemed to be having trouble running. Plus he is not that big a guy. We ran right at him. He could not get to Harris and Logan. I liked the game prep.

Williams looked good. With Hunter Steward at LT, we can work Williams in on some occasions. Even at Safety.
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So I agree with most of the good things that have been mentioned here but we shouldn't let a thrashing make us overlook some issues that cropped up.

1. DLine. I am still thinking that this is a problem. We are 2nd last in the league in sacks and I can't help but think that a competent QB would have a field day with our lack of pressure generally. The Als had a complete no show at the QB position tonight. It wasn't our relentless pressure that caused the poor offensive showing. It was a young QB who was clearly over his head.

2. Penalties. - Way too many again tonight especially of the undisciplined kind. 14 for 130 yards. The Als got 5 points today. 2 from a safety and 3 that came after a completely unnecessary roughing the passer call extended a drive which ended in field goal. Then we had a three undisciplined calls on Mr. Valli, Mr. Logan Mr. Harris. All completely avoidable and the kind of undisciplined calls that a good team might be better able to exploit.

3. Some have mentioned the play of the Oline as a bright spot today. I disagree somewhat. While they were improved, there were many occasions where Glenn was throwing it away quickly and it was damn good thing because anything slower than a quick throw and he would have been buried by 2 or 3 Als. At times it was though they weren't being blocked at all. Some outstanding catches by Arcenaux tonight made some bad situations look considerably better. It won't happen that way all the time.

4. Kicking - Could someone explain to me why we are so afraid to kick the damn ball down the middle when we are kicking from the other teams side of mid-field? We took an illegal kick penalty tonight because the ball was shanked while trying to angle for the side lines. Complete crap strategy sometimes. It is great to cut down the field when you can and limit the return but the Lions ended up giving field position needlessly using this strategy. Take a single if need be and have some faith in the special teams. Sometimes finesse should give way to brute force. In this situation, just kick the damn ball deep. We are likely to end up with a single and Montreal still would have had worse field position than what they got by us trying to angle it out of bounds and screwing it up badly.

In all, delighted with the improving play but there is still along way to go and much room for improvement.
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Ochocinco's body language is strange. His behaviour is good, but not good in a football sense. Disengaged. Confused. Lost on passing plays. Not taking advantage of motion. Not adapting well to the CFL game. I bear him no ill will. But I had doubts about this initiative from the get go.

At this time, based on his play, he does not deserve to be suiting up. So it seems to me.

Higgins also seems out of step. Out of touch. But then he kind of always seemed that way. Ned Flanders. Team getting killed, no spirit, no effort, but smiling.

Troy Smith? Quality guy. Character guy. But lost at QB.

Firing the OC? Tough spot for Dinwiddie.

Popp seemingly disengaged (not in the loop hiring Higgins), but now extended. Hopefully he is once again fully engaged.

Seeing this Alouette team tonight, one wonders how in the heck we let them pound us last time. Our game prep was so out of touch in Montreal. Plus the complete schmozzle with the O Line. It is kind of like we are late but in earnest. We cannot afford to be late in our prep or adaptation in the league at this time. Too many well coached teams.
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Sir Purrcival wrote:So I agree with most of the good things that have been mentioned here but we shouldn't let a thrashing make us overlook some issues that cropped up.

1. DLine. I am still thinking that this is a problem. We are 2nd last in the league in sacks and I can't help but think that a competent QB would have a field day with our lack of pressure generally. The Als had a complete no show at the QB position tonight. It wasn't our relentless pressure that caused the poor offensive showing. It was a young QB who was clearly over his head.

2. Penalties. - Way too many again tonight especially of the undisciplined kind. 14 for 130 yards. The Als got 5 points today. 2 from a safety and 3 that came after a completely unnecessary roughing the passer call extended a drive which ended in field goal. Then we had a three undisciplined calls on Mr. Valli, Mr. Logan Mr. Harris. All completely avoidable and the kind of undisciplined calls that a good team might be better able to exploit.

3. Some have mentioned the play of the Oline as a bright spot today. I disagree somewhat. While they were improved, there were many occasions where Glenn was throwing it away quickly and it was damn good thing because anything slower than a quick throw and he would have been buried by 2 or 3 Als. At times it was though they weren't being blocked at all. Some outstanding catches by Arcenaux tonight made some bad situations look considerably better. It won't happen that way all the time.

4. Kicking - Could someone explain to me why we are so afraid to kick the damn ball down the middle when we are kicking from the other teams side of mid-field? We took an illegal kick penalty tonight because the ball was shanked while trying to angle for the side lines. Complete crap strategy sometimes. It is great to cut down the field when you can and limit the return but the Lions ended up giving field position needlessly using this strategy. Take a single if need be and have some faith in the special teams. Sometimes finesse should give way to brute force. In this situation, just kick the damn ball deep. We are likely to end up with a single and Montreal still would have had worse field position than what they got by us trying to angle it out of bounds and screwing it up badly.

In all, delighted with the improving play but there is still along way to go and much room for improvement.
I agree with your assessment of the defensive line and penalties. There were several occasions Glenn should have thrown the ball away quicker to avoid the sacks. I'm not the coach but I suspect the reason the Lions were angling the football to the sidelines was to avoid Larry Taylor. He is a very dangerous kick returner.
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Sir Purrcival wrote:So I agree with most of the good things that have been mentioned here but we shouldn't let a thrashing make us overlook some issues that cropped up.

1. DLine. I am still thinking that this is a problem. We are 2nd last in the league in sacks and I can't help but think that a competent QB would have a field day with our lack of pressure generally. The Als had a complete no show at the QB position tonight. It wasn't our relentless pressure that caused the poor offensive showing. It was a young QB who was clearly over his head.

2. Penalties. - Way too many again tonight especially of the undisciplined kind. 14 for 130 yards. The Als got 5 points today. 2 from a safety and 3 that came after a completely unnecessary roughing the passer call extended a drive which ended in field goal. Then we had a three undisciplined calls on Mr. Valli, Mr. Logan Mr. Harris. All completely avoidable and the kind of undisciplined calls that a good team might be better able to exploit.

3. Some have mentioned the play of the Oline as a bright spot today. I disagree somewhat. While they were improved, there were many occasions where Glenn was throwing it away quickly and it was damn good thing because anything slower than a quick throw and he would have been buried by 2 or 3 Als. At times it was though they weren't being blocked at all. Some outstanding catches by Arcenaux tonight made some bad situations look considerably better. It won't happen that way all the time.

4. Kicking - Could someone explain to me why we are so afraid to kick the damn ball down the middle when we are kicking from the other teams side of mid-field? We took an illegal kick penalty tonight because the ball was shanked while trying to angle for the side lines. Complete crap strategy sometimes. It is great to cut down the field when you can and limit the return but the Lions ended up giving field position needlessly using this strategy. Take a single if need be and have some faith in the special teams. Sometimes finesse should give way to brute force. In this situation, just kick the damn ball deep. We are likely to end up with a single and Montreal still would have had worse field position than what they got by us trying to angle it out of bounds and screwing it up badly.

In all, delighted with the improving play but there is still along way to go and much room for improvement.

Some excellent points especially about the undisciplined penalties. It is often said that a team takes on the personality of the HC and the Lions have a HC that is animated and sometimes seemingly out of control (read undisciplined) on the sidelines. :hmm:
Last edited by DanoT on Sun Jul 20, 2014 12:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
TheLionKing
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WestCoastJoe wrote:Ochocinco's body language is strange. His behaviour is good, but not good in a football sense. Disengaged. Confused. Lost on passing plays. Not taking advantage of motion. Not adapting well to the CFL game. I bear him no ill will. But I had doubts about this initiative from the get go.
He had one pass thrown to him all night. If I recall he also had one pass thrown his way in our first meeting. Right now, Johnson is a highly paid decoy. Wouldn't surprise me if the Als release him.
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The number of penalties we took on ST concerns me. Luckily the Als were often committing fouls themselves on the same play so the net yards were minimized.

On the flip side it was a relief to not hear "holding #57" or "illegal procedure #57" all night long.
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It was a complete domination of the Montreal Als last night as our B.C. Lions showed that last week's win was not a one-game wonder but a turnaround from a poor first two games.

Here are some post-game thoughts.

OFFENCE

The headlines will be the 'Manny' show with three touchdowns as the big converted slotback showed his ability to go deep as well as outcompete for balls thrown in his area but Andrew Harris also had another big game, as he was a double threat on the ground and in the air.

At the end of last season our offence was powerful behind a run game of the newly aquired Stefan Logan to compliment Andrew Harris and a new blocking scheme. For some inexplicable reason, our offence came out in 2014 in the spread offence attempting to play pass and catch for our first two games and instead played get sacked and get whacked. This was the second game in a row that we priorized the running attack, used single and double tight end formations a lot, and opened some big holes for Harris and Logan.

Andrew Harris is playing like a tailback possessed. He has been a different player since Stefan Logan arrived. While Harris did not have many holes to run through during our running game doldrums in mid-season 2013, Harris also played uninspired football during that time as well. I think there are a few key reasons why Harris is playing the best football of his career. The first is that the addition of Logan to our running attack was a direct challenge to Harris, who, mid-season last year looked like he was playing as if the non-import tailback postion was locked up for good with him in the spot. Secondly, and more importantly, the addition of Logan enabled Harris to be much fresher when he was handed the football. I believe, like in the NFL, the CFL will go more often to sharing the tailback position, when there is the opportunity to do so, either with a national or the use of a scat back who is also a klck returner. Thirdly , Harris is getting that iniitail hole more often and he is making plays once he does.

Kevin Glenn has another excellent game. While we used single and double tight formations a lot again last night we still played more spread than I would have liked and Glenn faced a lot of pressure on most passing plays. Glenn's quick release and accurate throws were a key to our offence. Glenn had thrown the football for over 300 yard by the end of the third quarter. For those who think our offence will be even better when Lulay returns should pause in those thoughts for a moment. Glenn was sacked 4 times but could have been sacked 10 times and he made some very quick decisions and threw some very accurate footballs under pressure. Lulay will give us more mobility and a double threat quarterback but he will not be able to make the quick decisions and accurate throws as Glenn. Our Lions will not go for a two quarterback system when Lulay returns but it might make some sense.

Kudos to Hunter Steward for an excellent first game. He showed that a national can play the left tackle position and considering it was his first game and against a strategic, skilled blitzing defense his perfomance was impressive. The attention given to the left tackle position has underscored how well KIrby Fabian has played in his last two games. A key to our improved offensive line play has also been the improved play of Matt Norman on blitz and stunt pickup. He was terrible in our first two games but his play in the last two games has been a marked improvement.

Our offence got 21 points from turnovers and great field position at times due to a smothering defense.

I've watched our offence for 4 games now and we are basically running the same offence as last season and most of our offensive plays are right out of last season's play book. We used the old pitch toss against the Als a lot and Logan makes that play work so well due to his speed to the edge as well as his cut back ability. The only real wrinkles added to last year's offensive scheme are more plays with both Harris and Logan in the backfield, the use of Logan and Harris in the slots and sending them downfield on pass patterns or using the slotback hitch screen. We've also adapted the way we run the wide receiver hitch screen, with the receiver curiling back towards the quarterback.

The key is that (ike at the conclusion of last season) when we run the football and run it successfully our offence is very difficult to stop. When we don't run the football often enough or run it successfully, our offence stuggles when it is one dimensional. Our first two games we didn't committ to the run and we ran mostly out of the spread and we ran poorly, passed poorly, got our quarterback sacked and almost destroyed, turned the football over, and we last in the CFL in terms of time of possession. We left our defense on the field too long by not being able to mount drives, had too many two and outs, and the mauling that our offence was taking on the field was demoralizing.

The last two games, it was our offence doing the mauling by committing to power formations and the aggression of the run game. The recipe for offensive success and failure are clearly written based upon our wins and losses in our first four games. Hopefully, we won't deviate much from the offensive formula of these last two games as we continue this season.

DEFENSE

Our defense was much improved going into this 2014 season. The return of Khalif Mitchell and Jamal Johnson, the additions of Josh Johnson and Torri Williams, the draft of Menard to add Canadian depth on our defensive line, the move of an outstanding cover guy in Cord Parks to the very important short side half position, and the ability to replace Parks at wide side corner with a young aggressive cover guy in Stefan Yell.

The question marks coming into this season on defense were nickel back, safety, defensive end, and whether vets like Marsh and Phillips could play at a high level. Josh Johnson is more than answering the nickel back question. Torri Williams has shown that he can really play when given the opportunity but LaRose is still absent on many plays when he is in there. Marsh has been up and down but Phillips is still an excellent cover guy who most quarterbacks don;t want to attack.

When Torri Williams is in the game, we are still one player away, in that we don't have a pure, dominating rush end. Bezzie is giving us more than we had last season at rush end, which is helping Smith at the other end spot and Smith is defying odds with a great season so far. Khalif Mitchell's play during our first 3 games may not have stood out but Mitchell keeps offensive lineman off our linebackers (a big problem last season) and allows them to make plays. But this game also showed how far Westerman has come along and he had a very good game last night.

The Als offence looked badly out of sync but our defense also played a big role in getting them out of sorts too. To hold any team to that embarrasing amount of passing yards is impressive, no matter who is playing quarterback. Our linebacker play is terrific and it should be with the best linebacking unit in the league. We shut down Montreal;s passing attack and made it look horrible. We did that in the second half against the Riders too. Our defense has only given up one touchdown in the last two games.

What's been the difference. Having our offence move the football has enabled our defense to be a lot fresher. Having our offence not be mauled and play tough, aggressive in your face football featuring the running attack has been inspiring. But the key has been that our pass defense has not been in the soft zone of the first two games and played opposition receivers tough.

During our first two games our coaches coached really dum football and our players looked uninspired to boot. The last two games our coaches have given our players the type of game plans that have allowed them to play aggressive football and they've made plays because of it. The two early losses and especially the beat down in Montreal, gave our players a wake up call as well and they have rallied together. But the big difference has been coaching, on both sides of the football.

The coachiing weak spot right now is our return game on special teams. Too many penalties and a lack of key blocks is powerfully hampering an excellent return man's potential in Stefan Logan. McMann needs to join his two peers in Washington and Khari Jones in getting his return team's play turned around.

Benevedes is also making progress. The cockiness and posturing and sideline antics have really been toned down. The chest bumping and coach-player celebrations were removed last week. The ranting and demonstrative sideline antics were absent in this game. Getting off to a great start again and a huge win help but Benevedes also looks like he has received some sage advice regarding his deportment.

WRAP

It was a big win and a confidence boosting win to take on Montreal's blitzing defense and dominate it. This game showed how much talent we have on defence as well.

Winnipeg will be a very good test next weekend. A win and we will have solidified our new positive direction. A loss will create some new questions and a return of some old ones.

I liked what I saw against Montreal while still seeing that we have a lot more potential. We need to use our outside recievers more often in our pass game and we need to get even more pressure on opposing quarterbacks. The trend is our friend as we prepare for the Bombers.

A confidence boosting victory for our Leos. :rockin: :rockin:
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Vancouver native James 'Scotty' Doohan passed away 9 years ago today. I'd dedicate last night's game to him. He always did hate Shatner who was born in montreal :cool:

seeing the lions on fire is better than the actual one that is blazing in bc. :roar:
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TheLionKing wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:Ochocinco's body language is strange. His behaviour is good, but not good in a football sense. Disengaged. Confused. Lost on passing plays. Not taking advantage of motion. Not adapting well to the CFL game. I bear him no ill will. But I had doubts about this initiative from the get go.
He had one pass thrown to him all night. If I recall he also had one pass thrown his way in our first meeting. Right now, Johnson is a highly paid decoy. Wouldn't surprise me if the Als release him.[/quote

I noticed he was playing the wide side wideout position which tends to see the least amount of pigskin. Not sure there's much opportunity for him to be in motion unless the play calls for another receiver to be on the line of scrimmage.]
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Does anybody know if it's the stadium PA guy who comes to work with his seeing sye dog, his spotter or both? Wow he doesn't seem too have any sense of where the ball is. Announce a 6-7 yard BC run as a 4 yard gain. Another play he mistook the 6 yard line for the 1. Several others he was out to lunch not only in this game but the Eskimo game too.
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274always wrote:Vancouver native James 'Scotty' Doohan passed away 9 years ago today. I'd dedicate last night's game to him. He always did hate Shatner who was born in montreal :cool:

seeing the lions on fire is better than the actual one that is blazing in bc. :roar:
"Stay away from me you pointed ear FREAK!" Love Scotty and the original Star Trek series...my favourite TV show of all time.

Thanks for all the great comments guys from last night...Blitz, yours was outstanding, as usual...I was VERY TIRED when I wrote mine, but I wanted to go over a couple of points again...one, I still don't think Jone's game plan was all that great or smart...way too many chances taken with our young OLine and Kevin Glenn...as a result, Glenn had to make some dangerous throws, that yes, turned out for us, but could easily have been picked including the one in the end zone...Jones, IMO, needs to be more conservative and smarter with our passing game until such time we are clicking with all cylinders...we still are not.

Very little has been written about Hunter Steward and the OLine (exceptions to Joe and Blitz), but hey guys, that was an INCREDIBLE first effort from the young man...he was protected like I thought he would be, he was thrown to the wolves by Jones, and responded big time...and Blitz makes a key point, since Fabian's return our entire OLine has been better...flat out...Norman has settled in and can now just focus on his job instead of worrying about those around him...Valli and Olafoye have settled in on the right side...we really do have the makings of the best OLine in the league, one that can dominate teams and the LOS, and that's a recipe for championships!

Again, I can't say enough about Harris, he is ON FIRE! As for the receivers, what is Poblah still doing starting ahead of Haidara and especially the rookie Adekolu (who hasn't dressed yet since tearing up pre season)...to that end Glenn is going to have to start throwing some balls outside or defences will simply stunt and crowd to the middle of the field...which is the advantage of Travis Lulay who will throw the ball outside.

Westerman did a great job taking up bodies last night and pushing the LOS...he might not have had a lot of stats, but that was big effort...we need to resign him!

Benevides was not noticeable which is an improvement...even with setbacks in the future, he needs to maintain this cooler approach. As Blitz said, the WIN game will be a big one...the team needs to treat it like another must win...we need to be 3-2 after next week, the alternative is not acceptable.
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cromartie wrote:When you're bad, it's never as bad as you think it is.

When you're good, you're never as good as you think you are.

That said, I wouldn't want to be Montreal this weekend. There are some guys, particularly on defence, that are going to be angry. Very angry.
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As someone who was rooting for Troy Smith to do well, and thinking he was a CFL type QB going all the way back to his college days, that performance ranks up there with Mike Quinn's 8/10/2006 game and the time Kevin Eakin (?) retired on the field as the worst performances I've seen in recent memory against the Lions at QB.

I think, historically, I've seen Special Teams differently than a lot of other posters, in that I've felt we've had the wrong guys in key positions, in addition to a weak kicking game, and that that, rather than scheme, has been our biggest ST problem. So my view on McMann has been at least a little different. But I have to tell you, ST is a mess, this year, and the primary reason it has done as well as it has is because of how much better Ricky Schmitt has been than McCallum on punts and kickoffs. This is the role Hugh O'Neill was supposed to play last year. When I say it's a mess, I mean there is a significant lack of both lane and game discipline, and guys are consistently getting beat getting downfield. The Eskimos proved a couple of years ago that a good P and kickoff guy is worth the roster spot, and I think Schmitt is doing the same here.

So, shank aside, I'd like to give the briefest of props to Schmitt for freeing up McCallum to specialize in field goal kicking. It's a roster luxury, but one I'll gladly take at this point.

On defense, remember that this line performed fairly well without Khaliff Mitchell this week, against a D line that has played together for four years, and the best ally for a defensive line is an offense that stakes out a big lead, something the Lions haven't had prior to this game to date. Sack totals can be a bit misleading, so I'd give the line a bit more time to gel before getting overly concerned about sack numbers (I would love to see hurry/pressure numbers, though). And to a limited extent, a line that is still finding its way is ok at this point in the season when you have a back eight that is absolutely hammering runners and covering like crazy, and that's one area of this team that is doing extremely well. When even Phillips and LaRose are hitting people, you know the secondary is having a good game. On the whole, aside from the issues against the run in the early portion of the game (to which the defensive coaching staff adjusted well), this was a great defensive effort.

I feel terrible for McGarva. There's a guy I looked forward to watching develop. To injure the same knee twice just sucks.

Others have written more eloquently than I on the performance of the offensive line, so I'll just mention that the presence of Arceneaux in the lineup has multiple cascading effects. The first is that Jones can do more things with Harris and Logan that put defenders in difficult decision making positions, and these positions free up more of the intermediate passing game. This, in turn, lets Glenn get rid of the ball faster. Over 60 percent of his passes in the first half were out of his hands in the 3.0-3.15 second sweet spot, which was of great help to an offensive line that has great potential (finally!). Now, Glenn's discipline slipped a bit in the 2nd half ( a couple of his completions were what I call 'miracles', but as a 40,000 yard veteran, he gets the benefit of the doubt) but I won't argue overall. Manny matters. A lot, not just because he's Manny.

I mean, even John Beck looked good.

Not a big fan of our short yardage game. Partridge barely got in the end zone. Pick a hole and push your way in it.

I'm not going to tell you we're going to do the same thing to Winnipeg this week, because Winnipeg has discipline, a solid coach at the helm and isn't a tire fire at QB. But this is a defense that should be able to give Drew Willy (and Bo Levi Mitchell for that matter) fits enough to put the offense in a position to win fairly comfortably.

As for Chad Johnson, I doubt he's making more than a standard contract for an import receiver. His skill set is being wasted at the wide side receiver position. His problem, as TSN stated and the 1040 guys elaborated on, is that he can't go in motion prior to the snap of the ball. He was getting open, a lot, this week. It's just that Smith wasn't looking at him (I think he had only three targets the entire game). And there was a point beyond which the Lions defensively felt comfortable in leaving him open, knowing Smith wasn't going to throw to him. It's a bad spiral. He's being used wrong, because he doesn't have the skill set to be used correctly. But the talent is still there.
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Terrific analysis Blitz. I also like what I am seeing on the field. Benevides was toned down, but he was still waving his arms about trying to get players attention while his OC was standing right next to him signalling the play. My thought is that he feels "lost" on the sidelines without something to do. In one instance, the Oline were sitting down with a coach talking to them and Bene came over and said something to them, and you could see their heads swivelling. To me the time for the head coach to be coaching is not on the sidelines. But, yes, he has toned it down.

On ST, I notice that Phillips and Marsh on the punt return team. Yes, they have speed to get downfield, but are they the type of players that you want to be opening up seams for Logan to run through? Maybe Marsh, but Phillips??

I though that Glenn made some very "firm" passes over the middle under pressure. Those slant passes are an area that we should exploit with Gore and Taylor's sure hands now that the Oline seems to be able to move defensive players to the side so that Glenn has visibility and can throw an arrow, instead of having to loop it over the on-rushing defensive players.
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