All things Lions Marketing/Promotions 2014

[Solar Max]

Lions are pricing themselves out of the market. Everyone now has large HD TV's to watch compared to just a few short seasons ago.

It's getting harder to justify ticket prices for many folks I suspect.

Precisely

In Ottawa my ST are $540 each, South side first row upper deck 35 yard line. I had (along with some 40 others from R Nation) first crack at any seat we wanted because we got on the waiting list in 2008, and these suited my wallet and viewing tastes best.

I'm not sure how much those seats would be in BC place but I suspect $800 or better. After talking to Jeff Hunt, he made it clear that when the redevelopment of Lansdowne Park was underway, he insisted on lihmiting capacity to 25,000 ( sellout is 24, 398 as of a week ago Friday's game) to create demand. He then reached out to the community to create buzz about the football club.

I spent much of early July in Ottawa (a memorial service then the Redblacks experience) and of course the Sacred R was visible in the back window and windshield of the car the whole time I was there. I was frankly shocked at the level of interest in the club. People not only honked, waved and gave thumbs up, they would ask if i knew any way to get tickets for the upcoming game. There is swag in the stores, talk on the radio and sportscasts, as well as some 8500 who showed up at Lansdowne on game day...without seats for the game.

Three people actually came to the door to at my cousin's place to ask if we knew where to find tickets because they saw the window cling in the back windows of both of our cars.

Hunt admits that somehow they have captured lightning in a bottle, but he doesn't know EXACTLY how. I had some contact with Ottawa media, (TSN1200, CJOH, Ottawa Sun and Citizen) and to a person said that the football club had created a buzz that they wanted to cover and be a part of. Tim Baines said it was bigger than the arrival of the Ottawa Senators.

The point? Jeff Hunt reached out to the community via media, advertisement, talk shows, anything that he could do to reach young folks. He readily admitted to us older folks that he already had our interest, and that the teens and 20 somethings are the future of the Ottawa Football Club, not us.

George Chayka reaches out to Yaletown. Not Mission, Surrey, or Coquitlam, just Yaletown. He isn't going to grow the Lions brand by grabbing the interest of teens and 20 somethings in Yaletown alone. That's an epic fail, and raising ticket prices over and over has diminishing returns.

There is a lesson to be learned here George. Jeff Hunt says he took some cues from a fellow named Bob Ackles. You could do worse than to follow Bob's Way.

[notahomer]

In Ottawa my ST are $540 each, South side first row upper deck 35 yard line. I had (along with some 40 others from R Nation) first crack at any seat we wanted because we got on the waiting list in 2008, and these suited my wallet and viewing tastes best.

I'm not sure how much those seats would be in BC place but I suspect $800 or better. After talking to Jeff Hunt, he made it clear that when the redevelopment of Lansdowne Park was underway, he insisted on lihmiting capacity to 25,000 ( sellout is 24, 398 as of a week ago Friday's game) to create demand. He then reached out to the community to create buzz about the football club.

I spent much of early July in Ottawa (a memorial service then the Redblacks experience) and of course the Sacred R was visible in the back window and windshield of the car the whole time I was there. I was frankly shocked at the level of interest in the club. People not only honked, waved and gave thumbs up, they would ask if i knew any way to get tickets for the upcoming game. There is swag in the stores, talk on the radio and sportscasts, as well as some 8500 who showed up at Lansdowne on game day...without seats for the game.

Three people actually came to the door to at my cousin's place to ask if we knew where to find tickets because they saw the window cling in the back windows of both of our cars.

Hunt admits that somehow they have captured lightning in a bottle, but he doesn't know EXACTLY how. I had some contact with Ottawa media, (TSN1200, CJOH, Ottawa Sun and Citizen) and to a person said that the football club had created a buzz that they wanted to cover and be a part of. Tim Baines said it was bigger than the arrival of the Ottawa Senators.

The point? Jeff Hunt reached out to the community via media, advertisement, talk shows, anything that he could do to reach young folks. He readily admitted to us older folks that he already had our interest, and that the teens and 20 somethings are the future of the Ottawa Football Club, not us.

George Chayka reaches out to Yaletown. Not Mission, Surrey, or Coquitlam, just Yaletown. He isn't going to grow the Lions brand by grabbing the interest of teens and 20 somethings in Yaletown alone. That's an epic fail, and raising ticket prices over and over has diminishing returns.

There is a lesson to be learned here George. Jeff Hunt says he took some cues from a fellow named Bob Ackles. You could do worse than to follow Bob's Way.

Thanks for sharing. I do NOT know how to attract more fans, just how to keep me. And the best thing they have done to do that is field a team I can be proud of (that means 100% effort). It'll be interesting to see how the Lions copy from Ottawa. Do you say "its a special situation?" or do you try to learn?

I'm going to the Sept 5th game and REALLY looking forward to seeing the stadium/game and of course Ottawa itself.

[Solar Max]

Thanks for sharing. I do NOT know how to attract more fans, just how to keep me. And the best thing they have done to do that is field a team I can be proud of (that means 100% effort). It'll be interesting to see how the Lions copy from Ottawa. Do you say "its a special situation?" or do you try to learn?

I'm going to the Sept 5th game and REALLY looking forward to seeing the stadium/game and of course Ottawa itself.

I don't know that the Lions can attract new fans in Yaletown alone. In fact I have felt for a few years that the name itself is a misnomer, and it should instead be Yaletown Lions, not BC Lions, much as the BCJFL club here is known as Westshore Rebels, not Victoria Rebels.

Do you have seats for Sept. 5th? Are you doing the Lions travel thing? If not, tickets are at a premium. As of last Friday the 18th, there were only singles available for Greenwhites, and very much the same for Lions and Edmonton on the 15th.

We have extra seats squirelled away if you need a seat and can tolerate being in with R Nation in rabid Southside. PM me if need be.

PS: Northside sucks.

[Toppy Vann]

If I was Wally i would go out of my way to find Asian-American (or Cdn) players that can play. It is really no different than trying to find players from BC because they are more likely to re-sign and often for less $ so they can stay close to friends and family.

Having a very large and mostly financially well off Asian population in the lower mainland is an advantage that the other western teams do not have and the Lions should go out of their way to woo this ethnic fan base and Asian-American football players is the best way to do it.

Lions have a Chinese Canadian on the roster - Casey Chin

Dano is right. Market the heck out of the Chinese community and other ethnic groups and the gay community as that crowd has cash and lots of those folks live in downtown. Make the fan base as diverse as the population.

[TheLionKing]

Given the choice of Lions swag or cheaper prices, my vote will be for the latter.

[sj-roc]

If I was Wally i would go out of my way to find Asian-American (or Cdn) players that can play. It is really no different than trying to find players from BC because they are more likely to re-sign and often for less $ so they can stay close to friends and family.

Having a very large and mostly financially well off Asian population in the lower mainland is an advantage that the other western teams do not have and the Lions should go out of their way to woo this ethnic fan base and Asian-American football players is the best way to do it.

Lions have a Chinese Canadian on the roster - Casey Chin

Dano is right. Market the heck out of the Chinese community and other ethnic groups and the gay community as that crowd has cash and lots of those folks live in downtown. Make the fan base as diverse as the population.

Re: Asian communities, last year there was a Bollywood-themed halftime show. Perhaps something Chinese-themed would be the next step?

I recall hearing about Marco Iannuzzi in the Pride Parade last year; does that count? It's coming around again pretty soon, just a week away, perhaps he'll do it again.

http://twitpic.com/d6j261

I see the Vancouver Pride Society began a partnership with the Whitecaps last year to dedicate one game on their schedule each season as a "Pride with the Whitecaps" event. In fact, this year's Pride Night, their second, happened to coincide with their game just today (Sunday). This is certainly something the Lions could also consider.

http://vancouverpride.ca/events/pride-n ... whitecaps/

[sj-roc]

I just checked the Lions' seating chart on their website, turns out there are two versions. Too large to embed, so links only:

(1) Default:

http://cfl.uploads.mrx.ca/bc/images/gen ... 213247.jpg

and

(2) Sun Aug 24th (4pm start) Roughriders version:

http://cfl.uploads.mrx.ca/bc/images/gen ... 775631.jpg

This is same as default except with ten extra upper deck sections added: sections 410-418 inclusive, plus abutting halves of 409 & 419. These sections are directly opposite to those already open and represent an extra ~5000 seats for a total of about 37k; looking at TM I'd say there's only about 150-200 sold so far. Yes, in the hundreds but still nearly four full weeks away.

The pricing is identical to the same sections across the field, except that the $30 all-in areas map to the next cheapest price point (i.e., the touchdown endzone section, at $33.57+T&F=$44). The tickets sold so far are mostly in either the top price point, or in the best area of the $44 one (close as possible to the top price area, literally across the aisle and within 3 rows). I don't know when this Ssk chart was unveiled but the final uptake will be interesting. I'd have to think under 32k or only barely above would be a fail in the sense that this could have been contained in default, and perhaps would expose a misreading of the market.

It's been mentioned a couple times but perhaps worth repeating, this is the Save-On-Foods promotion game whereby reward points can be redeemed toward tickets:

https://www.morerewards.ca/catalogue/bc ... -august-24

[DanoT]

"BC Lions, the Pride of All BC" would seem to be a natural tie in with Gay Pride. And as already mentioned, lots of gays live downtown and have high disposable income. Throw in the chance to get dressed up in an outrageous Lions orange and black costume for game day and it is obvious that the gay community is a winner fan base that the Lions need to pursue. Might as well start with a BC Lions float in the Gay Pride Parade. BTW the second best week for money spent at Whistler after the week between Xmas and New Year's is Gay & Lesbian week at Whistler in early Feb.

As far as stadium configuration goes, the new stadium in Hamilton will have 24k seats between the goal lines and no end zone seats, and I think Ottawa' s stadium is similar. In BC's situation a lower bowl only set up would mean trying to sell lower priced lower bowl end zone seats while refusing fans the opportunity to pay more $ for upper bowl seats between the sidelines. A very bad way to market and maximize $.

I know I would never go over to the mainland from Victoria to sit in the end zone except maybe for a Grey Cup. BTW for this years GC, because I am a Lions 3-Pak ticket holder I got to select GC tickets right after the STHs got to buy tickets. I got a single ticket for the GC on the first row, upper deck, 54 yard line, my favourite place to sit.

[Solar Max]

Just as an aside, I believe I saw that beer was priced at $8.50 or $9.00 at BC Place Friday.

It's $5.50 in Ottawa. Somebody's making some coin.

[Hambone]

From a practical POV and as an aside, the capacity is perhaps several hundred lower than this because so many isolated singles often remain unsold as a tough sell until they're all that's left. With about 50 sections in the lower bowl (I think it's 46 to be exact), if you have about 8-12 singles per section, you're talking upwards of 500 tough sell/unsold seats, equivalent to an entire section. Many of these are in high rent sideline areas so it adds up to a lot of lost revenue.

I've been on ticketmaster looking at single game NFL tickets and I've seen a couple of teams (perhaps all?) have policies forbidding any sale that creates an isolated single unless there is no other way to buy the desired number of tickets (perhaps not even in that case). I suppose the NFL has deeper resources to enforce this but looking at it as a business issue, I think the Lions should also be doing more to reduce this but I wouldn't have any idea what exactly. I'm sure they're well aware of it and would like to act on it.

*This may or not include the luxury suite seating, but that's another story. I suppose each suite has a capacity, perhaps governed by fire safety regulations (let's say 15) and if the suite is rented out, then that 15 capacity figure is the one used for game attendance purposes regardless of how many actual bodies occupy it for the game.

The seat directly in front of me has been empty 2 out of 3 games this year and shows as available on Ticketmaster. Looking at a few games I can only presume it's the only seat out of the 18 in the row that is not held by a ST holder. From a marketing standpoint I think if they've sold 17 of 18 seat to ST holders and wind up with a loner to try selling on a single game basis that's quite OK. If they continue to sell it every 3rd game that's 156 seats sold out of a possible 162 in that row (96.2% success) over the season. From a selfish standpoint I love that there is an empty seat directly in front of me plus for my buddy with his company's pair beside my single it's like having a 4th ticket available if we need one.

There's a few suite configurations. My buddy and I were looking at one for a group of us for later in the season. At the time Christie was able to offer us a 15 seat suite and a 17 seat suite. By the time we canvassed our group for feedback they were gone. They also have what they call Pacific Suites. Those may have as many as 40 seats I think. I'd think they'd be treated like any other seats in the stadium. All are counted as part of the stadium capacity. When you book one I presume you receive 15 or 17 game tickets and the team would account for them the same as any regular seat in the stadium when they are announcing attendance ie fannies through the turnstiles vs tickets sold.

[B.C.FAN]

With the wider seats installed in 2011, a lot of rows now have an odd number of seats, hence the many singles available in the middle of rows. End zone sections went from 18 seats to 17. Some sideline sections have 23 seats.

[Lions4ever]

"BC Lions, the Pride of All BC" would seem to be a natural tie in with Gay Pride. And as already mentioned, lots of gays live downtown and have high disposable income. Throw in the chance to get dressed up in an outrageous Lions orange and black costume for game day and it is obvious that the gay community is a winner fan base that the Lions need to pursue. Might as well start with a BC Lions float in the Gay Pride Parade. BTW the second best week for money spent at Whistler after the week between Xmas and New Year's is Gay & Lesbian week at Whistler in early Feb.

The Lions marketing braintrust has elected to hitch its wagon to that domestic violence campaign with in-stadium spots and advertising signage around the field. I get that this is a serious social issue and it is noble of the Lions and they are to be applauded, but let's be honest. It's a real debby downer of a topic and isn't conducive to the entertainment escape that attending a sports event is, presumably, supposed to be about. I'm not saying don't do it, by all means it's an important social issue...but it seems to point the finger at the very fans they're trying to attract. That's the uncomfortable subtext: If you are involved in football or a fan of it and probably a male, you, more than the rest of the general population, need to heed this message about violence against our female population. They don't seem to have thought through that this is not a fun thing to be reminded about constantly during a game. There needs to be some sort of balance struck.

[sj-roc]

As far as stadium configuration goes, the new stadium in Hamilton will have 24k seats between the goal lines and no end zone seats, and I think Ottawa' s stadium is similar. In BC's situation a lower bowl only set up would mean trying to sell lower priced lower bowl end zone seats while refusing fans the opportunity to pay more $ for upper bowl seats between the sidelines. A very bad way to market and maximize $.

I believe the first time BCP began tarping, after the 1980s glory days ended, came during the 1993-1995 Bill Comrie era. At that time they tarped off both levels of both end zones (equivalent to the current Ott/Ham configurations), approximately sections 249-254, 201-206 above the dressing rooms and 222-231 opposite, plus the corresponding 400 level seats. This reduced capacity from ~59,500 to 40,800 (today it would prob be about 38k). Attendances in those days were typically in the high 20k's to mid 30k's for western opponents (and a loss) and in the high 10k's to low 20k's for eastern/US opponents (and a win).

A bit O/T but I kind of recall around 1995, there was a sense that the Lions would almost always lose at home whenever they played in front of a relatively big crowd against a division rival, as if wilting under stage fright. In fact it really wasn't until Buono came in that I began to gain confidence that we could consistently match up at home against the likes of Edm. Early on in his regime we beat Edm one night and I forget the details except that the stakes were fairly high, but I do recall mentioning to friends as we filed out, "That's the type of game we would have lost a few years ago. Tonight... we won."

[Spud387]

If the Lions want to drive up ST holder numbers and make a Lions game a go to event, they have to drive up demand. There are many ways to do this, but one of them is limiting available seats. Yes, you could possibly be turning away people and take a small gate hit. The idea is you limit the available seats and then the casual who comes to a game only once or twice a year, tries to buy a ticket to discover the nearest game is sold out. This puts the person in the mindset of "I'll need to buy my ticket ahead of time next time." This makes people commit to a ticket long before the date. Currently you can buy a ticket at the door with no worries. This removes the financial obligation to attend for someone who prebought a ticket. Currently you can wait till the last minute and if someone comes up (which often does during our summer months) there is no negative for them to not go to the Lions game.

The Lions need to limit the available seats so they get the "fake" sell-out and NOT raise prices. they do not want to have just enough seats available, they need to have just not enough available until that forces the demand to open some more sections that will also sell-out.

Supply & Demand 101. Lions need to create a demand, but currently the supply is too high

[TheLionKing]

Just as an aside, I believe I saw that beer was priced at $8.50 or $9.00 at BC Place Friday.

It's $5.50 in Ottawa. Somebody's making some coin.

Speaking of beer, I see the concessions are back to selling can beer. Wasn't there an issue a few years back about fans throwing empties onto the field ?