Lions' O Line for 2014 - Montreal shows how to build an OL

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WestCoastJoe
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Toppy, O Line play and coaching can get very complicated, sophisticated and difficult to teach. When JC made reference to the difficulty of teaching the run game, it is possible JC was making a veiled reference to the work situation he had with our O Line coach, the "Dean of CFL O Line coaches." Who has the authority? The OC or the O Line coach with tenure and status?

As I noted, interested parties might take a look at Alex Gibbs online. Extreme complexity, good success. But he holds himself up as a guru. And I expect even most coaches do not grasp all that he advocates. I expect it is similar with Dorazio. Once he starts talking to Buono or Benevides or Khari about schemes, or JC previously, I expect they go: OK, you take care of it. It can make your head spin. And Gibbs loves the tough talk too. "Rip his nuts" for a player making the wrong read, et cetera. Lots of F words. I kind of suspect he uses phrases such as snot balls and gas also. LOL

I can't help but think that Dan D bought into Gibbs' methods, a zone blocking specialist, or some similar advocate. But it is very hard to teach. When he brought this system to Denver, he favoured lighter, mobile O Linemen. Our guys do not have that mobility, or that kind of experience lending itself to zone blocking. We are built for power. And it seems to me it is almost part time football here. We do not seem to have the practice time, nor the wise veterans to learn a complicated system in a hurry.

My first exposure to angle blocking, IMO a precursor of zone blocking, was back in the early 1980s. At a coaching clinic, taking notes, as the HC of UNLV, as a speaker, explained his system. It is possible I still have notes of it somewhere. But not likely. His idea was based on the team not having the premium giants to play O Line. So they devised a system that featured double teams, and side approach. He called it angle blocking. Even a giant gives way to double teams. And giants are also moveable if approached from an angle. The smaller guys lose at the power game. It was impressive on film, and philosophically. The concept works. Now it has been taken to extreme levels of complexity.

One obvious example of angle blocking with the Lions, is when all the O Lineman slant hard to the right or left, angle blocking the defenders, who have to give way, and the entire mass of humanity rolls to the side. It seems to me we first saw its positive effect with Joe Smith hitting holes or cutting back. It can be devastating in the running game. But with all the reads, et cetera, zone blocking is obviously very difficult to teach.

Why do we see such failure to protect the quarterback? Why do we see such failure at times to open holes for the running game? IMO ... The defences do not cooperate. They do not line up the same way every time. They shift. They change positions. They slant. They stunt. They blitz. Many, many moving parts. Whom do I block? How do I get there? What is my partner doing? What is my technique? Usually too many things for the O Linemen to grasp and master in the heat of the moment, as they try to fulfill the requirements of the complicated zone blocking schemes. It has to be a coordinated effort by the O Line. And they have to read and think. There are a huge number of variables. Thinking kills athletic performance, and destroys confidence, and damages technique. Another problem we have is lack of smooth transition over time in the O Line. We have not built a deep, talented, experienced roster over the years since 2003. Our guys are young and inexperienced. Even veterans would struggle to learn this system, no doubt one of the reasons we ship so many international O Linemen out after a brief look see. Youngsters? We see the results. This is IMO based on the tape, the record and what we see since 2003.

I will post a couple of urls here about Gibbs. I respect what he has achieved, but I personally do not like his harsh style. And it seems to me the system, the techniques, and all of it do not have to be that complex.

Also I do not personally like cut blocking of the D Line. Dangerous. Like one coach says: "You have to get in their legs." Uggghhh ... Jimenez liked that, and took it to an extremely nasty level.
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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From the Wik ...

Good resume. No question. But very complex stuff. Not easy to teach.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Gibbs
Alex Gibbs (born February 22, 1941 in Morgantown, North Carolina) is a former NFL offensive line coach and former assistant NFL head coach. He currently serves as an offensive line consultant for the American football team the Denver Broncos. Gibbs is a well known proponent of the Zone Blocking scheme and popularized its use while he was Offensive line coach of the Denver Broncos.[1] Denver became famous at that time for its use of smaller, more agile offensive linemen and the success of its running backs, most notably Terrell Davis.[2] Gibbs was to enter his first season on Pete Carroll's Seattle Seahawks staff as the Assistant Head Coach and Offensive Line coach in 2010,[3] but announced his unexpected retirement a week before the start of the NFL's 2010 regular season.[1][4] In May 2013 he returned to the Denver Broncos in a consultant role.[5]
I recall posting on this, perhaps last year, with Vince Lombardi using some concepts of zone blocking long before it became what it is today.

http://www.sbnation.com/2014/7/25/59288 ... e-blocking

http://www.dawgsbynature.com/2014/3/18/ ... d-ben-tate





John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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Blitz wrote:
David wrote:If you have a brilliant, tenured professor yet his students are consistently getting Cs and Ds and his A students are becoming B students, while others are even dropping the course, is he still considered a great teacher?

I am, frankly, sick and tired of other CFL teams fielding average (at best) O-lines yet managing to pick up blitz pressure while giving their quarterbacks adequate time in the pocket, yet ours continue to rack up dumb penalties (likely from “information overload”), seem thoroughly overwhelmed by creative stunts and blitzes, while our quarterbacks take a pounding.

This has been going on for the past 12 years here, folks. It’s not a blip, or even a trend. One step forward, two steps back. Bring ‘em in for a look-see and cut ‘em the next week. Failure across the line has become entrenched and, I hate to say it, accepted. Meanwhile, because Coach Dorazio is widely regarded as one of the best position coaches in the league, we look for excuses to rationalize our troubles instead of examining the common denominator: “they’re young,” “inexperienced,” “not good enough,” “our QBs hang onto the ball too long,” “too many crossing patterns,” “too many injuries,” “it’s the O-Coordinator’s fault.” Shower. Rinse. Repeat.

Even in our Grey Cup winning year of 2006 with Murphy and Jimenez - our bully tackles – our quarterbacks were *beeotch* slapped around with 59 sacks, which was more than our defense had (56). Time to consider a fresh set of eyes and a new “teacher.”


DH :cool:
Since Dorazio arrived in B.C. we have had more than our share of struggles running the football or protecting the quarterback. We've had very mobile quarterbacks and very smart quarterbacks during Dorazio's tenure and all took more than their share of punishement. Dickenson actually started less than a 1/3 of the games that he was available for and dealt with multiple concussions. Casey Printers, in both of his stints as a B.C. Lion (MOP in 2004 and great start again in 2010) was soon injured. Buck Pierce was walking wounded. Jarious Jackson the same. Travis Lulay has followed in the same pattern. It's been very challenging to be a Lion quarterback in the Dorazio era.

Dickenson had great pocket presence as does Kevin Glenn. Printers, Pierce, Jackson, and Lulay were all very mobile. None has escaped the severe pounding. Dave Dickenson is the offensive coordinator in Calgary. Buck Pierce is coaching in Winnipeg. Jarious Jackson was offered a promotion to go to Edmonton this season. Lulay and Glenn will have opportunities in the future. Both are smart and have leadership qualities. Dickenson, Pierce, Jackson, Lulay have all been noted for excellent leadership abilities.

Chap took a lot of heat from me from 2005-2010. I mostly was not critical of Chap because I thought he wasn't a knowledgeable football coach. It was because he was a spread offence disciple. For the spread to work, you have to have an offensive line that can open quick holes for the run game and pick up stunts and blitzes in the passing attack, along with the tailback when he is kept in to block. The concept of the spread is that, with receivers spread out, it opens up the defense against the longer run, if you can get an initial block. In the pass game it creates matchup problems for the defense and makes playing zone much more dififcult. However, opposition defenses quickly picked up that we were susceptible against stunts and blitzes, often with clear, unimpeded lanes to the quarterback.

Chap took most of the heat as the offensive coordinator. Wally always knew how to deflect heat. Benevedes did the same at the end of last season. When Chap left at the end of 2006 and Hufnagel was hired as a consultant for 2007 as Kruck and Dorazio shared the offensive coordinator role, with Kruck calling the plays.
Hufnagel obviously realized that, in 2006, we had given up the most sacks in the CFL for the second year in a row (2005, 2006) and Printers had spent most of 2004, making plays with his legs...in other words we could not be a spread offence with that kind of line blocking, Dickenson took a beating in the 2005 WDF and he had to use his legs as the key to helping us win the Grey Cup in 2006, due to the pressure he faced against a 6th rated Montreal defense

Hufnagel advised us to run the football more and we started out 2007 with more of a run emphasis (which didn't make Geroy and most of our recievers very happy). When Dickenson and Pierce went down to injury early in 2007 we were forced to run the football even more, with Jarious getting his first starts that season. Joe Smith rushed the football hard and we won 9 of our last 11 regular season games with Jarious at the controls.

There was a notion that the problem was Chap's offence and it wa ..but mostly not because there was anything wrong with Chap's spread offence. All CFL offences were using it and most CFL offences are still spread offences. The problem was that Chap was dedicated to the spread when it was obvious that we did not have an offensive line that could open holes for the run game nor pass block effectively enough for the spread to work. That was my criticism of Chap - ChapBall was the spread offence and I would never run the spread with Dorazio coaching the offensive line.

In 2011, with our offence struggling with Lulay, who had started partway through 2010) Chap finally realized he was never going to get the blocking he needed. Instead he went multi-formational, mostly power on first downs, and began to use a lot of motion to have receivers assist with blocking for the run game and a lot of misdirection to help get Lulay more time in the pass game. We went on to win the Grey Cup and in 2012 our offence was the best in the CFL in both the run and pass game.

But in 2013, we couldn't get the blocks for Harris in the run game, even from power formations and opposition defenses did everthing to keep Lulay in the pocket, where he was able to buy less time. How did it get changed? It took the addition of Stefan Logan, more power formations on second down, and an entirely new run blocking scheme with 6 games to go (its exceptional for a pro team to change a blocking scheme during a season) for us to get things turned around.

The pattern of offensive lineman's play deteriorating has been a pattern under Dorazio and you see it today. Norman was best in his first season as was Rob Murphy as was Dean Valli and the list could go on and on. Offensive lineman who could never make it here have gone on to play successfully on other CFL teams. Our offensive lineman are often as injured as our quarterbacks have been, to boot.

Khari Jones came in as our new offensive coordinator with promise. He was a spread offence quarterback and coached the spread in Hamilton. I thought he would carry on with what worked at the end of last season and utilize more power formations. He didn't in our first two games. But he used more power formations in game 3 and went mostly power formation against Montreal for our second win of the season. I thought he had figured it out. But he went back to more spread against Winnipeg and Glenn was sacked 6 times and our offence was miserable again.

The reality is that the problem is that we do not get adequate line blocking or pass blocking from Dorazio and rarely have. As an offensive coordinator you have to scheme around the weakness. To make matters worse, Dorazio has had too big of a role for too long. He was the co-coordinator in 2007, even though he was not the play caller. Dorazio was our offensive coordinator in 2008, while Chap called the plays. He was the co-offensive coordinator in 2009, while Chap called the plays. When Chap took over as official offensive coordinator in 2010, Dorazio still had control of the run game and still does. He was even able to tell Benny to gamble on third and 3 in the Montreal game, two games ago. Its been a crazy situation for far too long and Jones now has the problem that Chap had.

Jones really has little choice but to mainly go power formation most of the time as long as Dorazio is coaching in B.C. That is the reality that took Chap too long and it will kill Jones if he doesn't learn the lesson from last game and the first two games of the season.

Jones is wearing it right now as Chap did. Our quarterbacks have worn it. As a qb you had better realize that you will often have less than 2 seconds to throw so you had better get it off as soon as it hits your hands or you had better be very mobile as well as a great escape artist. As a running back you have to create your own holes very often. Nor should our offensive lineman wear it. Olofoye looked like an ass last game, stepping inside to block on a pass play, while the defensive end came free for an unimpeded sack of Glenn. Olifoye was dominant in 2012 and slid a little last season and has again so far this season. That is to be expected. Its difficult to shine while playing in chaos.

So Jones had better figure out that he will wear it from Wally, as Chap did, if he doesn't take control as best he can and he better figure out quickly that he needs to use a scheme that can best adapt to the weakness of this Leos offence for too long - offensive line play. Its not talent or inexperience. Its not individual skill. Quite simply its offensive line coaching. Jones also better figure out that we need power formations to run the football and power formations to give our quarterback time to throw.. and we need this more than any other CFL offence and have for over a decade now.

Its the reality of being an offensive coordinator or quarterback for this team.
(Copied and brought over from the Post Game thread as it relates to a continuing problem.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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MexicoLionFan wrote:Blitz, I think it is becoming clear the Dorazio is the master behind this debacle...but, it the OC's job to make the offence run...and if that means running the ball, and structuring most of your offence out of power formations, so be it. Chaps KNEW what worked...but he didn't have the patience to stay with it...and ultimately HE killed our QBs by trying to run his highly complex system behind a sieve...you can't build the Great Wall of China on top of sand...and now Jones is in the same situation...IMO, Jones was reckless in the MTL game at home, and put Glenn under an enormous amount of pressure, its just that Arceneaux chose that day to have his career start and it bailed us out...because Glenn could EASILY have been sacked 10 times in the MTL game at home, and could have thrown up to 5 INTs if the MTL DBs had reacted better, or if Manny had not been so amazing...

IMO, Jones hasn't figured ANYTHING out yet...and as such, we are going to continue to struggle and get people hurt until he does...and if the Lions rush Lulay back into this Dorazio mess, they are going to destroy his career...Jones needs to wake up to power football and play action...as you said Blitz, the spread CANNOT function with Dorazio coaching the OLine...so now its up to either Wally to fire Dorazio (good luck) or Jones turning on the light and playing smash mouth football.

The Bottom Line is this...this is a JOKE that we as fans should have to put up with Dorzaio for this long...the evidence is out there now for everyone to see...
(Copied and brought over from the Post Game thread as it relates to a continuing problem.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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JohnHenry wrote:The main problem with the OL over the past several years is the linemen seemed confused about who they should block, often double-teaming one pass rusher while letting another rusher run free...and their inability to react to stunts or blitzes. This is more of an indictment on the decision-making process of the OL. I believe Dorazio is a good coach at teaching the linemen how to block, how to position their feet, gain leverage and bend their knees, ect...but not who to block. I'm not sure that's even the OL coach's bally-wick, it could be more of an issue with the OC and RB coach.

Another problem could be the physical and mental abilities of the individual linemen, who make wrong decisions and don't have the physical ability to block in the correct manner the coaches have instructed them.
(Copied and brought over from the Post Game thread as it relates to a continuing problem.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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Since I don't really know much about Zone Read Blocking I did some checking around the internet. I found out that it is best suited for a smallish undersized O line to attack the D from the side instead of straight on. So it requires pre snap figuring out the blocking assignments/angles and relies on everyone communicating, getting it right. Also very good footwork for positioning is required.

Since the Lions have a mostly inexperienced but very big O line, it would seem that the complex Zone Read Blocking is the wrong scheme for this group. They need to just take on the guy opposite and drive him into the next county. But Dan Dorazio is the Tenured Man and gets to use what ever blocking scheme that he likes irregardless of what works best. :bang:
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DanoT wrote: Since the Lions have a mostly inexperienced but very big O line, it would seem that the complex Zone Read Blocking is the wrong scheme for this group. They need to just take on the guy opposite and drive him into the next county. But Dan Dorazio is the Tenured Man and gets to use what ever blocking scheme that he likes irregardless of what works best. :bang:
Simple smash mouth football.
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TheLionKing wrote:
DanoT wrote: Since the Lions have a mostly inexperienced but very big O line, it would seem that the complex Zone Read Blocking is the wrong scheme for this group. They need to just take on the guy opposite and drive him into the next county. But Dan Dorazio is the Tenured Man and gets to use what ever blocking scheme that he likes irregardless of what works best. :bang:
Simple smash mouth football.
Simple in that the Lions need to give Glenn time to find a receiver, and that means right from the get go, as Glenn seems to get rather nervous when he doesn't trust the protection. The results of that are disaster, with unforced INT's, and cowering into the OL grouping rather than exposing himself outside of the pocket.
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WestCoastJoe
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Lowell Ullrich in the Province today writes that Hardrick is taking left guard reps ahead of Fabien. Tinker. Tinker. New experiment in the lab?

Great. Have we set Fabien back in his development? At right guard he was very, very promising, prior to his injury.

Will we give the hook to Hunter Steward also, before all that long of a time?

T Dre Player started at left guard for us. Looked pretty good for a rookie. Let's make a change.

Around and around it goes. Looking for just the right guys who can absorb the complexities of the O Line system?

But it is not Dorazio's fault. Lack of confidence. Erosion of skill. Confusion. Tinkering. Whom to block? Defenders with free runs at the QB. Lack of national development for much of the 12 years of this regime. Internationals brought in and shipped out at an alarming rate. High sack totals. Long dry spells in the running game. Injured QBs. On and on it goes ... Blame it on the OC. Blame it on the O Linemen not being smart enough. Blame it on the O Linemen not being agile enough. Blame it on the O Linemen being too inexperienced. Blame it on the O Linemen not executing. But do not look at the coach. Do not look at the product on the field. Do not look at changing philosophy, from technical to physical to technical. Are we about to go back to a more physical, simpler scheme?

Will Fabien start at left guard? Who knows? Will Hardrick start at left guard? Dunno ...

Andre Ramsey was our left tackle starter of choice for the first 3 games of this year, including exhibitions. This despite injury last year, and injury at TC this year. He is on IR now. R.J. Dill was #2 at left tackle on the depth chart for two exhibition games. Gone now. T Dre Player started 4 games for us at left guard. Did well for a rookie. Relegated down the list now.

Then, in desperation, after Nyere Aumaitre, slated to replace Ramsey, was unable to continue, we air lifted in Ryan Cave. Not a stopgap we heard. But that is what he was. Gone after two games at left tackle, one a victory. Kirby Fabien started 3 games for us at left guard. Relegated down the list now.

Two international tackles on the suspended list.

Can we get this thing working? Yes. At times during most seasons, things settle down. Sometimes it seems to take intervention by Wally. Two major objectives: Protect the quarterback. Open holes for the running game. Not an impossible task, one would think.

Gotta roll with it. Some criticism here and there. JC took a ton of it. Dorazio should be able to handle it. He has been an OC. Although he has never had the scrutiny of having to call the plays. And he has status and tenure within this regime. Responsibility and accountability go along with it. Can an O Line coach be an OC? Yes. Mike Gibson with the RedBlacks. Steve Buratto has been that. That was Vince Lombardi's background. OC with the Giants.

Will we have good O Line play vs the Stampeders? Possibly. One can always simplify things. Even players can simplify things in their own minds. It is basically individual players on the field battling for survival. Survival skills can bring very quick learning. I am supposed to go left, but I can see the DE will have a free shot at the QB. Hmmmm ... Dunno, better go left, I guess. The next big test will be a team whose defence blitzes heavily, stunts a lot, and moves the defenders around. Thorpe and Etcheverry do that. Jones does that. Stubler is more subtle. We will see ...
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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The frustrating thing is seeing problems and then those problems CONTINUING season after season.

For e.g. When were the Lions last decent on short yardage? It seems like its been AT LEAST 5 seasons (more?) since I waited with baited breath as the short yardage QB of the day ran those 2nd short/3short. And the goalline plays. And its not even short yardage but second & short. I know, I know same thing. Maybe. When the Lions have under a yard to go is often worriesome. What is ALSO very frustrating is seeing an Andrew Harris or Courtney Taylor get us 8 yards on a first down catch/run but then watch the LIONS just get stuffed to the point where we have to punt on third down.

IMO, the long standing short yardage issues are O-line related too. Is any other team struggling? Or am I seeing problems that just aren't there? I mean I see other teams have the odd struggle but its been a long, long time since I felt "OH, the LIons should convert that" without then being STUNNED when they do.... I like the Lions chances of converting on second down better on 3+ yards. Hopefully the stats will prove me wrong (or they'll patch this achilles heel), maybe it just seems they struggle........
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notahomer wrote:The frustrating thing is seeing problems and then those problems CONTINUING season after season.

For e.g. When were the Lions last decent on short yardage? It seems like its been AT LEAST 5 seasons (more?) since I waited with baited breath as the short yardage QB of the day ran those 2nd short/3short. And the goalline plays. And its not even short yardage but second & short. I know, I know same thing. Maybe. When the Lions have under a yard to go is often worriesome. What is ALSO very frustrating is seeing an Andrew Harris or Courtney Taylor get us 8 yards on a first down catch/run but then watch the LIONS just get stuffed to the point where we have to punt on third down.

IMO, the long standing short yardage issues are O-line related too. Is any other team struggling? Or am I seeing problems that just aren't there? I mean I see other teams have the odd struggle but its been a long, long time since I felt "OH, the LIons should convert that" without then being STUNNED when they do.... I like the Lions chances of converting on second down better on 3+ yards. Hopefully the stats will prove me wrong (or they'll patch this achilles heel), maybe it just seems they struggle........
Oh I think that you are bang on in your assessment, the second and 3 yards makes me feel about the same as third and short, or even worse. Teams stuff the Lions more than any other team on the 2nd and 3 yards, and while that may be OL play, it also reflects the tendencies the Lions do on 2nd and 3 yards to go as well. The last time I had a comfortable feeling, was when the Lions had Martell Mallett.
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Rammer wrote:........ it also reflects the tendencies the Lions do on 2nd and 3 yards to go as well. The last time I had a comfortable feeling, was when the Lions had Martell Mallett.
Yes, Mallet was a hammer, eh Rammer? Did convert some of those though.......
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Blitz wrote:
WestCoastJoe wrote:Great review and preview, Blitz.

Interesting to see the years, the coaches, and the players. And the one constant, like a toothache. In his own world, safe, no play calling responsibility, able to run endless experiments, and yet much power and authority in the organization.

We could get swamped by Calgary. We might even win. Because talented players can figure stuff out, they can communicate, and sometimes they can get it done, with a win, despite counter productive coaching. As noted before, the coaching evens out to a degree, as the season progresses. Pretty hard to grade the players down and rip them when they get the job done, and we win. Did you get your man? Did you make the play? Yes. Sometimes that is all that matters. Not how. But did you get it done?

I cannot call this game. Hardrick at left guard. Who knows? Manny and Andrew are always capable of game breaking plays. As is Logan.

Gonna be interesting ...
You've often talked about offensive line development, quarterback pressure WCJ.

Here is a very interesting statistic that is also very revealing. I just added up all the quarterback sacks from 2005 to present time.

Guess which team has given up the most quarterback sacks from 2005 -2014. The stats include the 2005 season and this season to date.

Well, its our B.C. Lions with 492 sacks given up. So much for the Mad Professor being the best of the best. Just think of all the other teams and some of the bad quarterbacks they had, the high number of changes in offensive coordinators and Head Coaches they endured - think of the bad teams for so long in Hamilton and Winnipeg during that stretch or the tough season in Edmonton and still we are the worst. Here is a closer look:

B.C. .............492 sacks
Hamilton........441 sacks
Saskatchewan..417 sacks
Winnipeg........399 sacks
Montreal........399 sacks
Toronto.........369 sacks
Calgary..........339 sacks
Edmonton.......337 sacks

Obviously playing quarterback for the B.C. Lions or being an offensive coordinator for the B.C. Lions has not been an easy task.
(Copied and brought over from the Keys to the Game thread, as it relates to an ongoing issue.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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notahomer wrote:
Blitz wrote:...........Here is a very interesting statistic that is also very revealing. I just added up all the quarterback sacks from 2005 to present time.

Guess which team has given up the most quarterback sacks from 2005 -2014. The stats include the 2005 season and this season to date.

Well, its our B.C. Lions with 492 sacks given up. So much for the Mad Professor being the best of the best. Just think of all the other teams and some of the bad quarterbacks they had, the high number of changes in offensive coordinators and Head Coaches they endured - think of the bad teams for so long in Hamilton and Winnipeg during that stretch or the tough season in Edmonton and still we are the worst. Here is a closer look:

B.C. .............492 sacks
Hamilton........441 sacks
Saskatchewan..417 sacks
Winnipeg........399 sacks
Montreal........399 sacks
Toronto.........369 sacks
Calgary..........339 sacks
Edmonton.......337 sacks

Obviously playing quarterback for the B.C. Lions or being an offensive coordinator for the B.C. Lions has not been an easy task.
Thanks for posting (and researching!). That is ONE SCARY STAT, IMO!!! :dizzy:

Maybe there is a reasonable reason? I can't figure out what that would be though. For e.g. maybe Edmonton's struggling offence over many of those seasons had them take less offensive snaps, thereby less sacks? But the next 3 teams have been playing in or winning Grey Cups consistently, so that excuse doesn't wash.

What is obvious is that the Ticats, a long struggling team kinda rebounding over past few seasons, are clearly also a team SET APART by their sack totals. BUT, then comes along the BC Lions ANOTHER FIFTY SACKS given up behind them.

WOW! Again, thanks for posting Blitz, certainly food for thought........
(Copied and brought over from the Keys to the Game thread, as it relates to an ongoing issue.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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WestCoastJoe
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MexicoLionFan wrote:Just an incredible post Blitz...it may have been your best ever, and that's saying a ton...and as Joe said, with our talent, we could get blown out in this game, or we could win. The Stamps don't have Cornish...they don't even have his backup...we have a tremendous chance (with Mitchell back in) of making CGY a one dimensional team, and creating turnovers with Biggie and Sol...but it comes down to the TWO other parts of our team...Offence and Special Teams...if Jones thinks he can play the same offence he has in the first 4 games in CGY, against Stubler, then we will lose and Glenn will take another vicious beating...but if he goes power formations and gets both Harris and Logan involved, then we have a great chance...but without Schmitt, we are still in trouble with our S Ts...McCallum wasn't good enough last week, in a dome, and now it will be a summer night outside in CGY...yikes...

Let's see what happens, but a loss here could send the Lions into a tailspin...its a big game...thanks to everyone for their excellent comments, and especially to Blitz for making this such a great place to visit and enjoy football! Great job guys!
(Copied and brought over from the Keys to the Game thread, as it relates to an ongoing issue.)
John Madden's Team Policies: Be on time. Pay attention. Play like hell on game day.

Jimmy Johnson's Game Keys: Protect the ball. Make plays.

Walter Payton's Advice to Kids: Play hard. Play fair. Have fun.
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