One or Two or Three Kickers?

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Robbie
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Some teams have one player to handle both placekicking and punting duties while other teams have two. I suppose when it came to kicking duos, two of the most well known in the last two decades were Trevor Kennerd/Troy Westwood and Bob Cameron for the Winnipeg Blue Bombers, along with Hank Illesic and Lance Chomyc for the Toronto Argos.

For most of their history, the Lions had a single kicker to handle both kicking duties. Since Lui Passaglia joined the BC Lions in 1976 until his retirement after 2000, he always performed both field goals and punts. The only brief exception was when his career was interrupted in 1988 during a contract dispute and he went to try out for the Cleveland Browns. In that year, originally the Lions brought on Tony Martino for both duties but he was ineffective, as was Roy Kurtz. Then Lions then released both of them and signed Bernie Ruoff at about the same time Passaglia returned to the team. It was decided that Ruoff would do the field goals while Passaglia would do the punting. But after missing several field goals in a certain game, Ruoff was also released and Passaglia was given both duties.

After Passaglia's retirement, Matt Kellett was brought on for both duties in 2001-2002, and then Duncan O'Mahony in 2004-2005, and finally Paul McCallum for 2006.

But let's not forget that there is a third kicking position: the one who handles the kickoffs. Although he is unofficially called the kickoff specialist, his official position is still a placekicker and apparently, there's no official term to distinguish him from the player who performs field goals.

I have noticed that in the case of the BC Lions, they have had several kickoff specialists. Therefore, even during Passaglia's long reign with the team, he was not the team's sole kicker. While Passaglia handled kickoffs up to around 1990, starting in 1991 he gave way to Giulio Caravatta who handled most kickoffs. Passaglia performed kickoffs again in the 1994 Grey Cup. But by the time the 2000 Grey Cup came, Bret Anderson performed kickoffs and he also handled them in the 2006 Grey Cup.

In both cases, why were Passaglia and McCallum not performing kickoff duties? I believe there were two reasons:

#1.
For Passaglia, despite the fact that he punted and kicked field goals well, I did notice that his kickoffs did not go very deep. So perhaps Caravatta performed kickoffs better. I don't know about how well McCallum performs in kickoffs. But overall, one would reasonably assume that the placekicker is most experienced and adept at kickoffs than any other player who doesn't specialize in kicking.

#2.
A more plausible explanation might be that the player taking the kickoff would be required to make tackles during the kickoff return when necessary. So it might be safer to have a stronger player who is more adept to making tackles perform a kickoff, rather than the usual placekicker who may not be used to performing tackles and therefore, is at a greater risk of facing a serious injury.

What are your thoughts on having one, two, or three kickers for field goals, punts, and kickoffs?
TheLionKing
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In an ideal world one guy who can do all three. This will free up a couple of roster spaces.
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Robbie
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But having just one kicker also presents a single point of failure should he get injured.
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There's an upside and downside to every option.
Blitz
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I prefer having two kickers....one for punting and one for field goals. If you have someone on the roster, like a Brent Anderson, who does other things, it's a wonderful luxury to have a third person handle kickoff duties. It allows your field goal kicker to save the strengh in his legs for field goals only and not waste his power handling kickoffs.

I like having two kickers for two reasons. The first is obviously it allows each to concentrate in games on one speciality. The second reason is that I like having the punter also be the back up field goal kicker and the field goal kicker being the back up punter. This does two things. First of all each push each other and provide a competitive edge at both practice and games. If one ever gets hurt you already have someone who has seen action in games ready to step in. Secondly field goal kicking can be a lonely profession. Having two guys creates a kicking unit, allows each to practice better, and they can share the ups and downs of a job that comes with a lot of pressure.

The punting and place kicking games have become so crucial and important. While having two players, a punter and a kicker, takes up an extra Canadian roster spot I really believe the cost is worth it. I would love to see the Leos go with McCallum as place kicker this season and allow Rob Pikula to punt. Pikula punted for over a 44 yard average last year during his bried stint and I believe he's a better punter than McCallum and only needs experience. It would also allow us to develop Pikula as the heir apparent to take over from McCallum one day.
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lion24
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i know Pikula had a good fg% in a small amount of attempts but i don't know a lot about him. does everyone believe he can be a consistent field goal kicker/punter?
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TheLionKing
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lion24 wrote:i know Pikula had a good fg% in a small amount of attempts but i don't know a lot about him. does everyone believe he can be a consistent field goal kicker/punter?
Buono seem to think he has potential as evidenced by his keeping Pikula around for the whole year.
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Robbie
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Blitz wrote:If you have someone on the roster, like a Brent Anderson, who does other things, it's a wonderful luxury to have a third person handle kickoff duties.
You mean Bret Anderson. :wink:
The punting and place kicking games have become so crucial and important. While having two players, a punter and a kicker, takes up an extra Canadian roster spot I really believe the cost is worth it. I would love to see the Leos go with McCallum as place kicker this season and allow Rob Pikula to punt. Pikula punted for over a 44 yard average last year during his bried stint and I believe he's a better punter than McCallum and only needs experience. It would also allow us to develop Pikula as the heir apparent to take over from McCallum one day.
Well said, but you still left out the issue of the kickoff kicker. Should Bret Anderson retire (again) or become injured, then should it be McCallum or Pikula to handle the kickoffs, or should it be a third player altogether?
Blitz
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Well said, but you still left out the issue of the kickoff kicker. Should Bret Anderson retire (again) or become injured, then should it be McCallum or Pikula to handle the kickoffs, or should it be a third player altogether?
Geez Robbie....you're putting the pressure on and I just might crack!! :wink: I would prefer a third player all-together if you have one who is on the roster and can kick it off deep!! However, you don't find a Bret Anderson every day!

If you don't have a Brett Anderson or someone like him who can perform kickoffs then I would highly recommend Pikula perform the kickoffs as well as his punting duties and have only McCallum perform place kicking duties. No sense wearing out that field goal leg, especially when it's an older one. However, even if our field goal kicker was young I would still prefer the punter performing the kickoff duties rather than the place kicker. Of course, if you needed an on-side kick near the end of the game I'd put the place kicker in there.

Now, that I've answered your question I think it's time you started practicing kickoffs Robbie! There is always room for a multi-purpose guy on the roster and no one could calculate the percentages of performing an onside kick at a certain time in the game than you!!! :rockin:
"When I went to Catholic high school in Philadelphia, we just had one coach for football and basketball. He took all of us who turned out and had us run through a forest. The ones who ran into the trees were on the football team". (George Raveling)
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Robbie
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Taking a look at this page on Lui Passaglia's career kicking statistics for the regular season:

http://www.lionbackers.com/luinumbers.html

It looks like he stopped becoming the regular kickoff placekicker for one season in 1986 before continuing in 1987. And then starting in 1995, he didn't perform many kickoffs either.

Two questions:

1. Who was the Lions main kickoff placekicker in 1986?

2. Starting around 1991, Giulio Caravatta performed kickoffs too but he shared them with Lui. In the 1994 Grey Cup game, it was Passaglia who performed all the kickoffs. From 1995 on to when Bret Anderson regularly performed kickoffs around 1999, who was the Lions main kickoff placekicker? Was it Caravatta or someone else?
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Robbie
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An article from the Province today on Mr. Multipurpose, Bret Anderson:

http://www.canada.com/theprovince/news/ ... e0f&k=5628

He reminds me of when Jan Carinci was a Lion.
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Robbie
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Tonight's situation is a reminder of how valuable someone like Bret Anderson is. After McCallum came down with an injury, Anderson had to fill in for both punting and placekicking duties. Anderson seemed to have trouble getting warmed up for his first punt went off the side of his foot and went directly out of bounds for a penalty. Anderson was good on two convert attempts, and didn't have to attempt any field goals.
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Robbie
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With the new rule, kickoffs occur more often. With McCallum injured, do you think Sean Whyte has been doing a good job doing all three duties?

I think he has. It's been a long while that a kicker is doing all three jobs.
祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。
改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。
祝你龍年行大運。
恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
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Toppy Vann
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Robbie wrote:With the new rule, kickoffs occur more often. With McCallum injured, do you think Sean Whyte has been doing a good job doing all three duties?

I think he has. It's been a long while that a kicker is doing all three jobs.

The Lions stopped using Lui on kickoffs as they felt he couldn't get it deep enough which was bogus if you watched the games. The advantage of a Bret Anderson was that it didn't unnecessarily risk your kicker to injury but he plays and he could get down field fast for the ball if there was a fumble - you might not want the kicker doing this. However, Lui was also able to kick onside kicks like no other kicker I have ever seen. If he was out all the time, it reduces the opponent's thinking that they might pull a short kick off in a situation where a team MIGHT do one, but also has enough time on the clock to NOT do an onside kick.

I think the Lions prefer 1 guy to do punting and FGs as that gives them another spot to develop and bring along other talent and add to depth on STs.
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Robbie
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Toppy Vann wrote:The Lions stopped using Lui on kickoffs as they felt he couldn't get it deep enough which was bogus if you watched the games. The advantage of a Bret Anderson was that it didn't unnecessarily risk your kicker to injury but he plays and he could get down field fast for the ball if there was a fumble - you might not want the kicker doing this.
Was that the reason why Giulio Caravatta started doing the kickoffs in 1991?
However, Lui was also able to kick onside kicks like no other kicker I have ever seen.
I remember he did this in game 6 of the 1989 season that allowed the Lions to win their first game.
祝加拿大加式足球聯賽不列颠哥伦比亚卑詩雄獅隊今年贏格雷杯冠軍。此外祝溫哥華加人隊贏總統獎座·卡雲斯·甘保杯·史丹利盃。還每年祝溫哥華白頭浪隊贏美國足球大联盟杯。不要忘記每年祝溫哥華巨人贏西部冰球聯盟冠軍。
改建後的卑詩體育館於二十十一年九月三十日重新對外開放,首場體育活動為同日舉行的加拿大足球聯賽賽事,由主場的卑詩雄獅隊以三十三比二十四擊敗愛民頓愛斯基摩人隊。
祝你龍年行大運。
恭喜西雅图海鹰直到第四十八屆超級盃最終四十三比八大勝曾拿下兩次超級盃冠軍的丹佛野馬拿下隊史第一個超級盃冠軍。
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